Discussion:
Unbelievers
(too old to reply)
Michael Christ
2009-04-11 05:24:30 UTC
Permalink
The Bible is for the unbelievers.

The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.



Michael Christ
bob young
2009-04-12 01:53:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] by humans who,
in their insecurity, wanted to ensure that people followed 'their' imaginary
god slavishly.

Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Member of S.M.A.S.H.
(Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor)

Man creates his gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
Post by Michael Christ
Michael Christ
Terry Cross
2009-04-12 04:26:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!

I can't wait to hear the rest of Bob's "young Bible" theory!

Maybe the Bible was invented last week on a flying saucer, Mr. Young,
with a false printing date just to fool you.

TCross
bob young
2009-04-14 04:56:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.

First English language translation:

By John Wycliffe [a British Greek scholar]

Born in Yorkshire, England, about 1320 Educated at Oxford
Opposed papal authority and many Roman Catholic doctrines
Dies from natural causes in 1384

Estimated date of First English Bible - about 1350

In 1525-1526 the Tyndale New Testament became the first printed edition of the
scripture in the English language.
Post by Terry Cross
I can't wait to hear the rest of Bob's "young Bible" theory!
Maybe the Bible was invented last week on a flying saucer, Mr. Young,
with a false printing date just to fool you.
TCross
Terry Cross
2009-04-14 11:09:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.

TCross
bob young
2009-04-23 09:47:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
John Fraser
2009-04-23 16:53:55 UTC
Permalink
Good afternoon Bob;
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the
testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
You have asked this question before and it seems nobody is anxious to
answer it. I shall try.

the soul

a) the seat of the feelings, desires, affections, aversions (our heart, soul
etc.)

b) the (human) soul in so far as it is constituted that by the right use of
the aids offered it by God it can attain its highest end and secure eternal
blessedness, the soul regarded as a moral being designed for everlasting
life

c) the soul as an essence which differs from the body and is not dissolved
by death (distinguished from other parts of the body)

It seems that our person is meant to live eternally. It seems that for
the most part, we're given a choice as to where we wish to spend that
eternity. I agree that there are many poor examples. But, the bottom line
will be about you, where you wish to spend eternity. It is my duty to
direct you toward God. God does not wish to be apart from those he created.
But, he gives us a choice as to whom we prefer to follow. All I can say is
that those who prefer not to follow God will be cut off. Those whose
purpose is to keep people from knowing God will be held accountable.and
likewise cut off with a greater punishment. Despite bad examples which say
and do not, God loves you and does not desire you go astray.

Cheers,
John
Yakka
2009-04-23 22:01:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Michael Christ
2009-04-23 22:38:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.


Michael Christ


Michael Christ
bob young
2009-04-24 05:00:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.
R A T H E R weak response
Post by Michael Christ
Michael Christ
Michael Christ
Yakka
2009-04-24 21:44:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.
In that case, when the brain dies completely, the mind is trapped
completely... not an attractive prospect.
Michael Christ
2009-04-24 23:33:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yakka
Post by Michael Christ
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.
In that case, when the brain dies completely, the mind is trapped
completely... not an attractive prospect.
Indeed, but not if you believe in a God that saves.



Michael Christ
Barry
2009-04-25 04:16:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
Post by Yakka
Post by Michael Christ
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.
In that case, when the brain dies completely, the mind is trapped
completely... not an attractive prospect.
Indeed, but not if you believe in a God that saves.
What you believe makes no difference.
Post by Michael Christ
Michael Christ
Barry
2009-04-25 05:03:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yakka
Post by Michael Christ
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.
In that case, when the brain dies completely, the mind is trapped
completely... not an attractive prospect.
Rather like someone with motor neuron disease?
Barry OGrady
2009-04-24 13:53:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Christ
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Perhaps the mind is just limited in its ability to express itself with brain
injuries...trapped if you like. Similarly, but not exactly, like in the
example where you lose the use of your limbs when you become a quadriplegic.
Nothing like that. The brain contains everything that makes "you."
Post by Michael Christ
Michael Christ
Barry
=====
Home page
http://members.iinet.net.au/~barry.og
John Fraser
2009-04-23 22:52:43 UTC
Permalink
Good evening Yakka;
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Don't know. Tests have been done which demonstrate a body loses a small
amount of weight upon death. If true, something went somewhere.

Cheers,
John
bob young
2009-04-24 04:59:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
V E R Y good point
Raymond
2009-04-24 23:04:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yakka
    It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
For one thing Jesus was dead and so his mind would be dead and after
three days came back to life and his mind was restored and so death of
the brain does not limit consciousness. Man is body, soul and spirit,
so death of the body has nothing to do with the mind the soul the
personality of a person lives on. Many have died over the years and
came back to life hours after death. The body is not eternal the soul
the mind the being that makes one different from a log or a dead thing
does live and nothing been proven that is not a fact.
bob young
2009-04-25 05:26:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Raymond
Post by Yakka
    It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
For one thing Jesus was dead and so his mind would be dead and after
three days came back to life and his mind was restored and so death of
the brain does not limit consciousness.
Oh dear oh dear - THAT was a silly myth
written at least seven hundred years later
Post by Raymond
Man is body, soul and spirit,
define soul and spirit using a modern definition
Post by Raymond
so death of the body has nothing to do with the mind the soul the
personality of a person lives on.
Garbage
Post by Raymond
Many have died over the years and
came back to life hours after death.
cite
Post by Raymond
The body is not eternal the soul
the mind the being that makes one different from a log or a dead thing
does live and nothing been proven that is not a fact.
Groan
dolf
2009-04-25 06:06:54 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
Post by bob young
Post by Raymond
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
For one thing Jesus was dead and so his mind would be dead and after
three days came back to life and his mind was restored and so death of
the brain does not limit consciousness.
Oh dear oh dear - THAT was a silly myth
written at least seven hundred years later
Post by Raymond
Man is body, soul and spirit,
define soul and spirit using a modern definition
Post by Raymond
so death of the body has nothing to do with the mind the soul the
personality of a person lives on.
Garbage
Post by Raymond
Many have died over the years and
came back to life hours after death.
cite
Post by Raymond
The body is not eternal the soul
the mind the being that makes one different from a log or a dead thing
does live and nothing been proven that is not a fact.
Groan
Terry Cross
2009-04-25 00:59:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
(who is the convincee?)
Post by Yakka
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
(who is "we"?)
Post by Yakka
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear
(to whom?).
Post by Yakka
that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Your amazing philosophy avoids identifying any observer. Then you
miraculously arrive at the conclusion that no observer exists. Ta da!

TCross
Barry
2009-04-25 04:20:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
(who is the convincee?)
Post by Yakka
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
(who is "we"?)
Post by Yakka
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear
(to whom?).
Post by Yakka
that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Your amazing philosophy avoids identifying any observer. Then you
miraculously arrive at the conclusion that no observer exists. Ta da!
The important thing is that he is right. Everything that make "you" is
contained in
your brain. Proof of that is the fact that changes to the brain may cause a
complete
change in personality. As much as you may not like it, when your brain stops
working
"you" no longer exist.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
bob young
2009-04-25 05:32:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
(who is the convincee?)
Post by Yakka
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
(who is "we"?)
Post by Yakka
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear
(to whom?).
Post by Yakka
that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Your amazing philosophy avoids identifying any observer. Then you
miraculously arrive at the conclusion that no observer exists. Ta da!
The important thing is that he is right. Everything that make "you" is
contained in
your brain. Proof of that is the fact that changes to the brain may cause a
complete
change in personality. As much as you may not like it, when your brain stops
working
"you" no longer exist.
Much as they would like to cite proofs of humans dying and then coming to life
again, of course they cannot. what CAN be shown however is that when someone
has accidentally had a blow to the head this can completely change their
personaity and character

Everything we are revolves around the brain, when we die the brain stops
functioning - end of everything. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
dolf
2009-04-25 06:08:33 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
Post by bob young
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Yakka
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems that this is wishful thinking. There is no convincing evidence
(who is the convincee?)
Post by Yakka
that the mind can continue to exist after the brain dies. Indeed, as we
(who is "we"?)
Post by Yakka
look at the impact of brain injuries and brain disease on a person's
personality, it becomes clear
(to whom?).
Post by Yakka
that consciousness is totally dependent
on the brain.
Your amazing philosophy avoids identifying any observer. Then you
miraculously arrive at the conclusion that no observer exists. Ta da!
The important thing is that he is right. Everything that make "you" is
contained in
your brain. Proof of that is the fact that changes to the brain may cause a
complete
change in personality. As much as you may not like it, when your brain stops
working
"you" no longer exist.
Much as they would like to cite proofs of humans dying and then coming to life
again, of course they cannot. what CAN be shown however is that when someone
has accidentally had a blow to the head this can completely change their
personaity and character
Everything we are revolves around the brain, when we die the brain stops
functioning - end of everything. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
bob young
2009-04-24 04:58:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fraser
Good afternoon Bob;
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the
testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
You have asked this question before and it seems nobody is anxious to
answer it. I shall try.
the soul
a) the seat of the feelings, desires, affections, aversions (our heart, soul
etc.)
These are emotions not explanations. Soul is used as a noun in most
ecclesiastical applications
Post by John Fraser
b) the (human) soul in so far as it is constituted that by the right use of
the aids offered it by God it can attain its highest end and secure eternal
blessedness, the soul regarded as a moral being designed for everlasting
life
All you do here is try to show what a soul can do if it is motivated by a god.
First you have to prove that god before it can be used to prove a soul
Post by John Fraser
c) the soul as an essence which differs from the body and is not dissolved
by death (distinguished from other parts of the body)
Define 'the essence of a human being'
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally.
It seems nothing of the sort. Living eternally is a side effect of having an
advanced brain which can assimilate fear and through superstition modify this
fear using religion as providing life after death. This is of course a con
which should be criminalised
Post by John Fraser
It seems that for
the most part, we're given a choice as to where we wish to spend that
eternity.
So early frightened humans wrote in the scriptures. Apart from that there is
nothing to show anything about choices
Post by John Fraser
I agree that there are many poor examples. But, the bottom line
will be about you, where you wish to spend eternity.
Smile - when I go I will be gone - just like E V E R Y O T H E R Human
being
Post by John Fraser
It is my duty to
direct you toward God.
That is how you have been trained, perhaps even brain washed from the cradle
just as your parents were by their parents, if we persue this back far enough
we eventually reach back to the primitive who made up the Christian religion in
the first place.

Hindus can do it too - they reach back to a god that has the body of a woman
and the head of an elephant
Post by John Fraser
God does not wish to be apart from those he created.
STOP RIGHT NOW. That is you talking not a god. Let us keep this conversation
on an honest level if you don't mind !
Post by John Fraser
But, he gives us a choice as to whom we prefer to follow.
See above
Post by John Fraser
All I can say is
that those who prefer not to follow God will be cut off.
Religion means power, provided there are huge numbers of 'believers', so this
threat is used and has been used since time immemorial. Something else that
needs to be criminalised.

You see you are falling back on the same old tactics that have been 'used' for
as long as we can remember to justify a belief system, that is entirely devoid
of proof - only re-used words and phrases.
Post by John Fraser
Those whose
purpose is to keep people from knowing God will be held accountable.and
likewise cut off with a greater punishment.
Aaaaah, trying now to justify your actions ?

Suggestion - remove your blinders take a look around you, there is a normal
world out there waiting to be lived in - and it is free from constraints of the
kind you have enumerated above.

Have a nice week

Cheers

Bob
Barry OGrady
2009-04-24 13:53:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fraser
Good afternoon Bob;
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
You have asked this question before and it seems nobody is anxious to
answer it. I shall try.
the soul
a) the seat of the feelings, desires, affections, aversions (our heart, soul
etc.)
You mean the brain.
Post by John Fraser
b) the (human) soul in so far as it is constituted that by the right use of
the aids offered it by God it can attain its highest end and secure eternal
blessedness, the soul regarded as a moral being designed for everlasting
life
The brain doesn't last forever.
Post by John Fraser
c) the soul as an essence which differs from the body and is not dissolved
by death (distinguished from other parts of the body)
You mean nothing.
Post by John Fraser
It seems that our person is meant to live eternally. It seems that for
the most part, we're given a choice as to where we wish to spend that
eternity.
The facts say otherwise. Damage and dugs may change a person
completely, and when brain activity stops the person is no more.
Post by John Fraser
I agree that there are many poor examples. But, the bottom line
will be about you, where you wish to spend eternity. It is my duty to
direct you toward God. God does not wish to be apart from those he created.
But, he gives us a choice as to whom we prefer to follow. All I can say is
that those who prefer not to follow God will be cut off. Those whose
purpose is to keep people from knowing God will be held accountable.and
likewise cut off with a greater punishment. Despite bad examples which say
and do not, God loves you and does not desire you go astray.
Two things you should know.
All things are possible for God.
God is not wiling that any shall perish.

Put the two together and you can be sure none will perish.
Post by John Fraser
Cheers,
John
Barry
=====
Home page
http://members.iinet.net.au/~barry.og
Terry Cross
2009-04-24 23:29:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by bob young
Post by bob young
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh.  And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir.  May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.

The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.

In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.

I refer the title "Ms."

TCross
Barry
2009-04-25 04:15:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
bob young
2009-04-25 05:44:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman
to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."

1st Timothy 2:11

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted
unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also
saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their
husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."

I Corinthians 14:34-35

"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."

Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33

"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]

"And I find more bitter than death the woman, whose heart is snares
and nets, and her hands as bands: whoso pleaseth God shall escape from
her; but the sinner shall be taken by her."

Ecclesiastes 7:26

"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no
woman to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not
permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under
obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let
them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak
in the church." I Corinthians 14:34-35

"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33

"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]

Who said religions were not the work and the creativeness
of the men of the time . . . . . ?

Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Member of S.M.A.S.H.
(Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor)

Man creates his gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
bob young
2009-04-25 07:29:09 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
Hardly, I leave all the crap postings to the likes of you and fastnerd.
Post by bob young
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman
to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted
unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also
saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their
husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."
I Corinthians 14:34-35
"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]
"And I find more bitter than death the woman, whose heart is snares
and nets, and her hands as bands: whoso pleaseth God shall escape from
her; but the sinner shall be taken by her."
Ecclesiastes 7:26
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no
woman to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not
permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under
obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let
them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak
in the church." I Corinthians 14:34-35
"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]
Who said religions were not the work and the creativeness
of the men of the time . . . . . ?
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Member of S.M.A.S.H.
(Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor)
Man creates his gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
dolf
2009-04-26 00:03:04 UTC
Permalink
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.

And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
light out of the void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism:
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]

The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, “that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.”

- Loading Image...
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.

The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].

- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Post by bob young
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
Hardly, I leave all the crap postings to the likes of you and fastnerd.
Post by bob young
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman
to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted
unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also
saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their
husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."
I Corinthians 14:34-35
"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]
"And I find more bitter than death the woman, whose heart is snares
and nets, and her hands as bands: whoso pleaseth God shall escape from
her; but the sinner shall be taken by her."
Ecclesiastes 7:26
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no
woman to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not
permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under
obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let
them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak
in the church." I Corinthians 14:34-35
"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]
Who said religions were not the work and the creativeness
of the men of the time . . . . . ?
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Member of S.M.A.S.H.
(Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor)
Man creates his gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
Barry
2009-04-26 01:00:02 UTC
Permalink
Main Entry:
letters patent
Function:
noun plural
Date:
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
dolf
2009-04-25 06:07:34 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
Post by bob young
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman
to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted
unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also
saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their
husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."
I Corinthians 14:34-35
"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]
"And I find more bitter than death the woman, whose heart is snares
and nets, and her hands as bands: whoso pleaseth God shall escape from
her; but the sinner shall be taken by her."
Ecclesiastes 7:26
"Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no
woman to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent."
1st Timothy 2:11
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not
permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under
obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let
them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak
in the church." I Corinthians 14:34-35
"And a man will choose...any wickedness, but the wickedness of a
woman...Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die."
Ecclesiastes 25:18, 19 & 33
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and
misbegotten, for the active power of the male seed tends to the
production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the
production of a woman comes from defect in the active power...."
[Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica,Q92, art. 1, Reply Obj. 1]
Who said religions were not the work and the creativeness
of the men of the time . . . . . ?
Bob
Humanist, atheist, realist, sentimentalist Brit.
Member of S.M.A.S.H.
(Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor)
Man creates his gods in his own image;
and then spends the rest of his life
manipulating them to his heart's content
Terry Cross
2009-04-27 23:04:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides.  The soul is the element of
consciousness.  Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.  Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.  And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
No.
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
No.
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
It would be the same in a synagogue or a mosque, but I don't go to
synamosques or churchagogues, so I do not find that to be a problem.

TCross
Barry OGrady
2009-04-30 05:24:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides.  The soul is the element of
consciousness.  Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.  Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.  And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
No.
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
No.
You are forced to recognise that the human body is a machine which
will not function correctly if damaged.
What you can't accept is that the brain is a machine which does all
the processing and which contains everything that makes "you."
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
It would be the same in a synagogue or a mosque, but I don't go to
synamosques or churchagogues, so I do not find that to be a problem.
You are not permitted to teach a man anywhere.
In the eyes of God you are nothing.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
Barry
=====
Home page
http://members.iinet.net.au/~barry.og
John Fraser
2009-04-30 15:03:16 UTC
Permalink
Good afternoon Barry;
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:04:13 -0700 (PDT), Terry Cross
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
No.
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
No.
You are forced to recognise that the human body is a machine which
will not function correctly if damaged.
What you can't accept is that the brain is a machine which does all
the processing and which contains everything that makes "you."
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
It would be the same in a synagogue or a mosque, but I don't go to
synamosques or churchagogues, so I do not find that to be a problem.
You are not permitted to teach a man anywhere.
In the eyes of God you are nothing.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
Barry
In the eyes of God, there would be no children without women. However,
some male children never get past the age of "me". The problem Paul
actually addressed had more to do with rivalry as he did not feel it was
proper for women to interrupt and over rule male leadership simply because
they didn't agree. On that note, I find amusing that you would want to
impose a rule from something you normally disregard.

Whether there is a measurable soul or not, it seems a Dr. MacDougall,
seeking to determine "if the psychic functions continue to exist as a
separate individuality or personality after the death of brain and body,"
constructed a special bed in his office "arranged on a light framework built
upon very delicately balanced platform beam scales" sensitive to two-tenths
of an ounce. He installed upon this bed a succession of six patients in the
end stages of terminal illnesses (four from tuberculosis, one from diabetes,
and one from unspecified causes); observed them before, during, and after
the process of death; and measured any corresponding changes in weight. He
then attempted to eliminate as many physiological explanations for the
observed results as he could conceive:

The patient's comfort was looked after in every way, although he was
practically moribund when placed upon the bed. He lost weight slowly at
the rate of one ounce per hour due to evaporation of moisture in respiration
and evaporation of sweat.
During all three hours and forty minutes I kept the beam end slightly above
balance near the upper limiting bar in order to make the test more decisive
if it should come.

At the end of three hours and forty minutes he expired and suddenly
coincident with death the beam end dropped with an audible stroke hitting
against the lower limiting bar and remaining there with no rebound. The loss
was ascertained to be three-fourths of an ounce.

However, it seems that several experiments of Dr. MacDougall conducted
with humans were not consistent and therefore inclusive regarding the actual
post mortem weight. He also checked sheep and dogs, but did not observe a
measureable weight loss.

Cheers,
John
Barry OGrady
2009-05-07 01:32:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fraser
Good afternoon Barry;
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 16:04:13 -0700 (PDT), Terry Cross
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
The soul is that which knows and decides. The soul is the element of
consciousness. Without a knower, knowledge is impossible. Without
knowledge, science has no meaning. And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold.
IOW, the brain.
No.
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul, but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
What they mean is that they have a brain.
No.
You are forced to recognise that the human body is a machine which
will not function correctly if damaged.
What you can't accept is that the brain is a machine which does all
the processing and which contains everything that makes "you."
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Barry
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
In that case you are not permitted to speak in church or teach a man.
It would be the same in a synagogue or a mosque, but I don't go to
synamosques or churchagogues, so I do not find that to be a problem.
You are not permitted to teach a man anywhere.
In the eyes of God you are nothing.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
Barry
In the eyes of God, there would be no children without women. However,
some male children never get past the age of "me". The problem Paul
actually addressed had more to do with rivalry as he did not feel it was
proper for women to interrupt and over rule male leadership simply because
they didn't agree. On that note, I find amusing that you would want to
impose a rule from something you normally disregard.
I thought it was more a case of God having been invented by a
male oriented society. It is not surprising that God was made in
the image of the people of the time.
Post by John Fraser
Whether there is a measurable soul or not, it seems a Dr. MacDougall,
seeking to determine "if the psychic functions continue to exist as a
separate individuality or personality after the death of brain and body,"
constructed a special bed in his office "arranged on a light framework built
upon very delicately balanced platform beam scales" sensitive to two-tenths
of an ounce. He installed upon this bed a succession of six patients in the
end stages of terminal illnesses (four from tuberculosis, one from diabetes,
and one from unspecified causes); observed them before, during, and after
the process of death; and measured any corresponding changes in weight. He
then attempted to eliminate as many physiological explanations for the
The patient's comfort was looked after in every way, although he was
practically moribund when placed upon the bed. He lost weight slowly at
the rate of one ounce per hour due to evaporation of moisture in respiration
and evaporation of sweat.
During all three hours and forty minutes I kept the beam end slightly above
balance near the upper limiting bar in order to make the test more decisive
if it should come.
At the end of three hours and forty minutes he expired and suddenly
coincident with death the beam end dropped with an audible stroke hitting
against the lower limiting bar and remaining there with no rebound. The loss
was ascertained to be three-fourths of an ounce.
However, it seems that several experiments of Dr. MacDougall conducted
with humans were not consistent and therefore inclusive regarding the actual
post mortem weight. He also checked sheep and dogs, but did not observe a
measureable weight loss.
I thought that had been dismissed as an old wives tale long ago.
Post by John Fraser
Cheers,
John
Barry
=====
Home page
http://members.iinet.net.au/~barry.og
Raymond
2009-05-07 02:00:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry OGrady
Post by John Fraser
Good afternoon Barry;
   In the eyes of God, there would be no children without women.  However,
some male children never get past the age of "me".  The problem Paul
actually addressed had more to do with rivalry as he did not feel it was
proper for women to interrupt and over rule male leadership simply because
they didn't agree.  On that note, I find amusing that you would want to
impose a rule from something you normally disregard.
I thought it was more a case of God having been invented by a
male oriented society. It is not surprising that God was made in
the image of the people of the time.
God made man in HIS image not the other way around.
Barry OGrady
2009-05-10 05:06:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Raymond
Post by Barry OGrady
Post by John Fraser
Good afternoon Barry;
   In the eyes of God, there would be no children without women.  However,
some male children never get past the age of "me".  The problem Paul
actually addressed had more to do with rivalry as he did not feel it was
proper for women to interrupt and over rule male leadership simply because
they didn't agree.  On that note, I find amusing that you would want to
impose a rule from something you normally disregard.
I thought it was more a case of God having been invented by a
male oriented society. It is not surprising that God was made in
the image of the people of the time.
God made man in HIS image not the other way around.
It just seems odd that God has the same personality as the people who
invented him. It makes sense that the creators of God would give their
new God the same beliefs and moral standards as themselves.

Barry
=====
Home page
http://members.iinet.net.au/~barry.og

bob young
2009-04-25 05:37:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by bob young
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh.  And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir.  May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.

No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
Barry
2009-04-25 08:17:27 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Reckon you can teach Dolf to train surf electric trains?
dolf
2009-04-26 00:04:14 UTC
Permalink
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.

And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
light out of the void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism:
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]

The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, “that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.”

- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/herald.jpg
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.

The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].

- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Post by Barry
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Reckon you can teach Dolf to train surf electric trains?
Barry
2009-04-26 01:01:21 UTC
Permalink
Come on Dolf! That was years ago!

Main Entry:
letters patent
Function:
noun plural
Date:
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
dolf
2009-04-26 02:33:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry
Come on Dolf! That was years ago!
letters patent
noun plural
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
The GRAPPLE paradigm as a Balanced Ternary Distributed System, maps to
the Chinese DAOist (#81 element, ternary number theory) and I-Ching (H64
elements as binary apparatus) to produce by extrusion, Hebrew and other
language based categories of understanding by deploying this in
conjunction with a chronological syllogism, or logical appeal: [Greek:
syllismos meaning ‘conclusion,’ ‘inference’], where usually the
categorical syllogism—such as: "No servant can serve two masters: for
either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to
the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

And the Pharisees also, who were covetous, heard all these things: and
they derided him."

As a kind of logical argument in which one proposition as the conclusion
or Telos [#2187 = 3^7 or 'oth cycle: #2184 / #6000 = 122J3W1D] is
inferred from two others [the major premise: which contains the law of
that will as 7 x 24 x 13 = 2184 days of the 'oth cycle] and [the minor
premise: which contains the command to behave in accordance with the
law, that is, the principle of subsumption under the law: x 49 = 6J or
294 x 364 days or 365.2425 x 293 years - Vernal Equinox Wednesday 20
March] of a certain form.

THE BIBLICAL COSMOLOGY (AS 10 COMMANDMENTS) IS ASSOCIATED TO A BALANCED
TERNARY DISTRIBUTED SYSTEM

"And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men;
but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men
is abomination in the sight of God.

The law and the prophets were until John {the grace or mercy of the
Lord}: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man
presseth into it."

#1 = [the major premise {YANG/FATHER/HEAVEN/MALE/FORM - Formula of
Universal Law}, which contains the law of that will:

7 x 24 x 13 = 2184 days of the 'oth cycle = 6D or 6 x 364 associated to
the 'constant sequence of sun and moon' as 354 x 3 + 30 day
intercalation = 1092 days x 2 = 2184 days] +

#2 = [the minor premise {YIN/MOTHER/EARTH/FEMALE/MATTER - Formula of
Humanity - HEAD OF STATE}, which contains the command to behave in
accordance with the law, that is, the principle of subsumption under the
law:

x 49 = 6J or 294 x 364 days or 365.2425 x 293 years - Vernal Equinox
Wednesday 20 March 1996 / 21 March = 1 Nisan 5756; and] +

#3 = [the conclusion {ZHUN/SON/SEA/ENUMERATE/OFFSPRING - Formula of
Autonomy}, which contains the verdict (sentence), that is laid down as
right in the case at hand: ... 6,000 topical years as Telos ('achariyth
as 122J3W1D) = Arch (re'shiyth as 3W1D) + c² [9(9²+1)/2]:

has #369 with Septet #41 {ie. #81 - #27 - #9 - #3 - #1} centric on {ie.
20 March 1996 + (5*364) + 182 = 12 Sept 2001 as 1st day of 7th solar
month = #0 - Zero point} 13-17 September 2001 / 18 September = 1 Tishri
5762. ref: "On [Sunday 16 September as] the 1st day of the [21st
priestly] course of Jachin {he that strengthens and makes steadfast} on
the 29th day of lunar month, on the 5th day of the 7th solar month."
[4Q321]] +

#4 = 'OTH Chronological Elements = #10 as {Totality of Nature = Formula
of Progression of individual phenomena: #1 = {0: 1} + #2 = {0: -1, 1: 1}
+ #3 = {0: 0, 1: 1} + #4 = {0: 1, 1: 1} = #10 = {0: 1, 1: 0, 2: 1}}

vCube Balanced Ternary System distribution: #1 = {0: 1}; #41 = {0: -1,
1: -1, 2: -1, 3: -1, 4: 1}; #81 = (0: 0, 1: 0, 2:0, 3:0, 4:1}

ONE: 1, 2, 3
TWO: 0, 3, 6
THREE: 0, 9, 18
FOUR: 0, 27, 54 = Chinese Tetragramation (Yang, Yin, Zhun) of Number
(Imperial Governance of male - dragon, female (consort) - phoenix: 206
BCE to 220 CE published 2 BCE); cf: [Deuteronomy 4:1-20]
FIVE: 0, 81, 369 = 9(9²+1)/2 - Organisation of the Myriad of things
SIX: 0, 243, 729 = Appraisals within vCube (9 x 9 x 9)
SEVEN: 0, 729, 2187 = 17 March (Saint Patrick's Day) + 2 x 'OTH CYCLE of
1092 (6 x 364 = 6D) days as Genesis and substantiation of Christian
identity.

"And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass [1 John 5:7], than one
tittle of the law to fail: "In his first audience at the Vatican since
his divorce from Diana, Princess of Wales, the Prince was expected to
receive a gift of a "luxury facsimile" of an appeal to Pope Clement VII
in 1530 CE in which English peers asked for the annulment of Henry
VIII’s marriage to Catherine of Aragon.

This follows after the Telegraph.co.uk Online Newspaper had in the first
week of April reported, that the words "Willyam Thomas, I pray yow pray
for me your lovyng master: Prynce Henry" are from a prayer roll once
belonging to the teenage Henry, who gave the roll to William Thomas, one
of his personal servants in his Privy Chamber, some time between 1505
and 1509 CE, when Henry was the Prince of Wales.

That we are able to determine whether the Monarch was a godly man by
measuring the chronological steeping to the Grapple Homoiotic Noumenon
as intellectual property and hypostatic metashematizo of homoousion. The
prayer roll will be shown in public for the first time at the British
Library's exhibition Henry VIII: Man and Monarch, which opens later this
month and marks the 500th anniversary of Henry's accession to the
throne. [Copyright and Courtesy Roya Nikkhah, Arts Correspondent,
Telegraph.co.uk 2009.4.4: Exciting discovery reveals Henry VIII as firm
believer in Catholicism]

Pope Benedict XVI, drawing on the analogy of an earthquake that had
several days earlier, struck the Italian Abruzzo region severely
damaging many churches, said "there is another 'ruin' that is far more
serious [to] that of people and communities! Like Francis [of Assisi (c.
1181-1226)], always start with yourselves. We are the first house that
God wants to restore.

If you are always able to renew yourselves in the spirit of the Gospel,
you will continue to assist the pastors of the Church to make more and
more beautiful the Church's face, that of the bride of Christ. The Pope,
now the same as then, expects this of you... Now go and bring to all the
peace and love of Christ the Saviour. May Mary Immaculate, 'Virgin made
Church', accompany you always. And may my Apostolic Blessing, which I
cordially impart to all of you here present, and the entire Franciscan
family, support you as well." [(c) 2009 Zenit News Agency 2009.4.20,
ZE09042008, Benedict XVI's Castel Gandolfo address to the Franciscan
Family: Attracting Christian Men and Women of All Ages]

The original appeal attributed to a hoax in news reports of 2009.4.20,
spoke of an important document in the history of the Reformation, which
is kept in the Vatican’s secret archives. But I've repeated here the
substance of the hocus-pocus {ie. hax pax max Deus adimax: material
objections by which to undertake various transformations related to
artificial or natural phenomena} amongst the hoi-polloi who may
recognize this hoity-toity and historical impunity to the Sovereign
autonomic right to regulative freewill as the ‘right to remain silent’
and ‘presumption of innocence’ under the Commonwealth amounts to Treason.

According to reports, Benedict XVI intends the gift as a good-will
gesture to assist in the healing of relations between the Vatican and
the Church of England. But some believe the guesture originates from a
parody of the Roman Catholic liturgy of the eucharist, which contains
the phrase "Hoc est enim corpus meum". This explanation goes back to
speculations by the Anglican prelate John Tillotson (1630-1694), who
wrote in 1694: "In all probability those common juggling words of hocus
pocus are nothing else but a corruption of hoc est corpus, by way of
ridiculous imitation of the priests of the Church of Rome in their trick
of Transubstantiation."

Or it may simply be imitation Latin with no meaning, made up to impress
people: "I will speak of one man... that went about in King James his
time... who called himself, The Kings Majesties most excellent Hocus
Pocus, and so was he called, because that at the playing of every Trick,
he used to say, Hocus pocus, tontus talontus, vade celeriter jubeo, a
dark composure of words, to blind the eyes of the beholders, to make his
Trick pass the more currently without discovery, because when the eye
and the ear of the beholder are both earnestly busied, the Trick is not
so easily discovered, nor the Imposture discerned." [According to
Wikipedia Sources 2009: Thomas Ady, A Candle in the Dark, 1656]

However, it will also serve as a reminder of the schism rooted in Henry
VIII’s battles with the Holy See over the binding nature of marriage: "I
have read in Times Online that, for the occasion of the forthcoming
visit of the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall, the Pope is to
gift his illustrious visitors a fascimile of the 1530 CE appeal by
English peers to Pope Clement VII asking for the annulment of Henry
VIII's marriage to Catherine of Aragon (From the Times April 20, 'The
Pope's gift...' Richard Owen, Rome) This news is completely untrue and
has no basis whatsoever in fact. I would ask you to issue an immediate
and unambiguous denial. Yours faithfully" [Federico Lombardi S J, Holy
See Press Office, Vatican City 2009.4.20]

The Prince was the first senior member of the Royal Family to marry a
divorcée since Edward VIII [who had to abdicate in 1936 to marry the
American Wallis Simpson. The Roman Catholic Church considers marriage a
legal and sacred bond "which cannot be broken using temporal laws"]. He
will also be the first to receive a facsimile of the document from the
Pope. [Copyright and Courtesy Foreign Staff Reporters, Telegraph.co.uk
2009.4.20: Charles and Camilla to be reminded of Pope's view of divorce]

Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth
adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband
committeth adultery.'" [Luke 16:13-18 (KJV)]

International news media proffers important perspectives of this year's
Easter Sunday as Christianity's most important feast day, when the
faithful mark their belief in the resurrection of Christ after Jesus'
death by crucifixion. Zenit news agency (www.zenit.org) reflects on the
symbolism of the 2009 Easter Vigil (additional reporting syndicated by
Associated Press) which for Christians worldwide, represents God's
promise of eternal life after death, of love's triumph over death.
According to media reports from The Australian newspaper of 0619 hours
2009.4.23, "A man has died after a lump of concrete smashed through the
windscreen of his car in inner Sydney.

http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html#***@zen:1,row:5,col:4,nous:43

The 53-year-old Perth man suffered facial and head injuries when the
lump of concrete fell from a white tipper truck and hit his front
windscreen, police said.

The man was driving along South Dowling Street, in inner-city
Darlinghurst, about 1240 hours ***@zen: 1, row: 5, col: 9, nous:
21 [Super: #259 / #21 - Guiding and the Physical/ Emptying the Heart;
I-Ching: H31 - Influence; Tetra: 42 - Going to Meet, Ego: #429 / #21 -
Guiding and the Physical/ Emptying the Heart; I-Ching: H31 - Influence;
Tetra: 42 - Going to Meet] yesterday ***@zen: 2, row: 1, col: 9,
nous: 16 [Super: #348 / #22 - Point to Reversal?/ Humility's Increase;
I-Ching: H8 - Seeking Unity; Tetra: 34 - Kinship, Ego: #213 / #16 -
Being a Guide/ Returning to the Root; I-Ching: H28 - Excess; Tetra: 75 -
Failure] when he passed the truck as he drove through the Flinders
Street intersection.

He was taken to St Vincents hospital suffering fractures and internal
injuries and died during surgery about 7pm (AEST). ***@zen: 1,
row: 8, col: 4, nous: 7 [Super: #261 / #7 - Intentional Reversal/
Dimming Radiance; I-Ching: H12 - Stagnation; Tetra: 56 - Closed Mouth,
Ego: #183 / #7 - Intentional Reversal/ Dimming Radiance; I-Ching: H12 -
Stagnation; Tetra: 56 - Closed Mouth]

'Inquiries suggest the driver of the truck, which did not stop, may have
been unaware of the incident,' police said."

http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html#***@zen:5,row:1,col:9,nous:36

Benedict prayed that Christians would "shine as lights in the world"
amid "the confusions of this age" and amid the search for values to put
"order" in our lives.

"The gravitational pull of love is stronger than that of hatred; the
force of gravity of life is stronger than that of death," Benedict said
in his homily reflecting on the mystery of Christian belief in the
resurrection, in which is seen the most sublime fulfillment of what this
text describes as the beginning of all things--the Church reads the
account of creation as a prophecy. This Gospel is according to the
revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began but now made
manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures made known to all nations,
according to the commandment of the everlasting God: [Romans 16:25-26]

The Torah perspective of cosmogony associated to the Mysteries as
conveyed by the Book of Genesis appears identical to the Chinese Daoist
literature: "The Mystery of which we speak in hidden places, as dazzling
light from the infinite and fiery brilliance out of the boundless
unfolds (li or chang: 'to expand') the myriad species (categories) from
the primordial chaos as the holding place for Being, without revealing a
form of its own:

- Loading Image...

It fashions the stuff of (ie. gives birth to and nourishes) Emptiness
and Formlessness (of the primordial chaos), giving birth to the
regulations (ie. the circular motion of the sun). Tied to the gods in
Heaven and the spirits on Earth (ie. The Way is a daemonic equivalent to
these potencies; cf: #60), it fixes the models (mo: numbers or shu:
calculations). It pervades and assimilates past and present, originating
the categories. It unfolds and intersperses yin and yang, generating the
chi'i (as the vitality which informs the entire cosmos and binds all
humans to the rest of phenomena)." [Michael Nylan, Hsuan Li (Evolution
of the Mystery), Canon of Supreme Mystery 1993:429, 64]

By a supposed lack of evidence, one or two assume we know as much that
there is to know about science and the universe. There's no doubt more
yet to be discovered, that explains the nature of the strong and weak
forces, rather than merely acknowledging their effects. It's not like
science has a theory of everything, science really is still relatively
recent on the timeline of human achievements.

"First of all," he said, "there is light": "Where there is light, life
is born, chaos can be transformed into cosmos." And in this regard
seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of light out of the
void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism: "The work of the
Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal life. God himself
is not the created light, but the Author of all light, whereof in the
divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid, which implieth
the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews affirm, that God is
fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys produceth, is the
fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate intelligences, beyond
the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity, aether. Having overcome
these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know the cohabitation of the
immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic
Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The History of Philosophy, p 573]

"The resurrection of Jesus is an eruption of light," Pope Benedict
explained. "Death is conquered, the tomb is thrown open. The Risen One
himself is Light, the Light of the world. With the resurrection, the
Lord’s day enters the nights of history. This statement is especially
pertinent, given the possibility of exhuming of Australian War dead in
French and European battlefronts. That the internment {as repatriation
to named graves}, isn't necessarily in keeping with the religious value
of their philosophical beliefs made under the Commonwealth, of such
immortals dwelling in eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free
forever more abounding as dawning light upon the morn.

Pope Benedict said, "Beginning with the resurrection, God’s light
spreads throughout the world and throughout history. Day dawns. This
Light alone -- Jesus Christ -- is the true light, something more than
the physical phenomenon of light. He is pure Light: God himself, who
causes a new creation to be born in the midst of the old, transforming
chaos into cosmos."

According to a chapter titled 'Sciences preparative to Philosophy' on
page 523 of the 1687 CE fascimile edition of the History of Philosophy,
the onomantick number doctrine of Pythagoras considered Number as
propositionally an Intellectual Property of the Divine Mind : "Number is
of two kinds, the Intellectual (immaterial: ecclesiastical and
sapiental) and the Sciental (ternary quantitative: measured and weighed,
having magnitude or spatial extent). The Intellectual is that eternal
substance of Number, which Pythagoras in his Discourse concerning the
Gods asserted to be the principle most providential of all Heaven and
Earth, and the nature that is betwixt them. Moreover, it is the root of
Divine Beings, and of Gods, and of Daemons.

This is that which he termed the principle, fountain, and root of all
things, and defined it to be that which before all things exists in the
Divine Mind; from which and out of which all things are digested into
order, and remain numbered by an indossoluble series [as hierarchy].

For all things which are ordered in the world by nature according to an
artificial course in part and in whole, appear to be distinguished and
adorned by Providence and the All-creating Mind, according to Number;
the Exemplar being established by applying (as the reason of the
principle before the impression of things) the number pre-existent in
the Intellect of God, maker of the world. This only in intellectual, and
wholly immaterial, really a substance according to which as being the
most exact artificial reason {eg: COMMONWEALTH and its technological
(Deus ex machinas) relationship to the Grapple Homoiotic Noumenon as
intellectual property and hypostatic metashematizo of homoousion}, all
things are perfected: Time, Heaven, Motion, the Stars, and their various
revolutions." [Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th
Section, 1687 edition, The History of Philosophy, p 523]

"At the Easter Vigil," the Pontiff said, "the Church represents the
mystery of the light of Christ in the sign of the Paschal candle, whose
flame is both light and heat. The symbolism of light is connected with
that of fire: radiance and heat, radiance and the transforming energy
contained in the fire -- truth and love go together. The Paschal candle
burns, and is thereby consumed: The cross and the resurrection are
inseparable."

Benedict XVI said that the second symbol, water, has "two opposed
meanings": On the one hand there is the sea, which appears as a force
antagonistic to life on earth, continually threatening it; yet God has
placed a limit upon it. Hence the book of Revelation says that in God’s
new world, the sea will be no more. It is the element of death. And so
it becomes the symbolic representation of Jesus’ death on the Cross:
Christ descended into the sea, into the waters of death, as Israel did
into the Red Sea. Having risen from death, he gives us life.

This means that baptism is not only a cleansing, but a new birth: with
Christ we, as it were, descend into the sea of death, so as to rise up
again as new creatures.

He said the other "way in which we encounter water is in the form of the
fresh spring that gives life, or the great river from which life comes
forth." Yet within Oriental and Occidental Sapiental literature in which
the seasonal garden [Genesis 2:8-14] is a metaphor for the governing of
empire: "A large state is the lower reaches of a river: The place where
all the streams of the world unite. In the union of the world, the
female always gets the better of the male by stillness. Being still, she
takes the lower position. Hence the large state, by taking the lower
position, annexes the small state; The small state, by taking the lower
position, affiliates itself to the large state." [DAO TE CHING #61 -
Virtuosity at Using 'Beneath'/ Virtue of Humility; I-Ching: H64 - Before
Completion; Tetra: #78 - On the Verge]

"Without water there is no life," the Pontiff affirmed. "It is striking
how much importance is attached to wells in sacred Scripture. They are
places from which life rises forth. Beside Jacob’s well, Christ spoke to
the Samaritan woman of the new well, the water of true life."

"The reason why the River and the Sea are able to be king of the hundred
valleys is that they excel in taking the lower position. Hence they are
able to be king of the hundred valleys. Therefore, desiring to rule over
the people, One must in one's words humble oneself before them; And,
desiring to lead the people, One must, in one's person, follow behind
them. Therefore the sage takes his place over the people yet is no
burden; takes his place ahead of the people yet causes no obstruction.
That is why the empire supports him joyfully and never tires of doing
so. It is because he does not contend that no one in the empire is in a
position to contend with him." [DAO TE CHING #66 - Strategic Reversal/
Putting Oneself Behind; I-Ching: H41 - Decrease; Tetra: #55 - Diminishment]

Benedict XVI then reflected on the third symbol, "the singing of the new
song -- the alleluia."

"When a person experiences great joy, he cannot keep it to himself," he
explained. "He has to express it, to pass it on. But what happens when a
person is touched by the light of the resurrection, and thus comes into
contact with Life itself, with Truth and Love? He cannot merely speak
about it. Speech is no longer adequate. He has to sing."

"At the Easter Vigil, year after year, we Christians intone this song
after the third reading, we sing it as our song, because we too, through
God’s power, have been drawn forth from the water and liberated for true
life," he said.

Recalling the story from the Bible when Moses sang a song after Israel's
liberation from Egypt, the Pope said the "image describes the situation
of the disciples of Jesus Christ in every age, the situation of the
Church in the history of this world."

"Humanly speaking, it is self-contradictory," he explained. "On the one
hand, the community is located at the Exodus, in the midst of the Red
Sea, in a sea which is paradoxically ice and fire at the same time."
[Zenit News Agency, 'Pontiff: Church will never Sink', ZE09041207 -
2009-04-12]

Benedict said Jesus, like a shepherd, gave guidance to his flock. "What
great compassion he must feel in our own time too – on account of all
the endless talk that people hide behind, while in reality they are
totally confused. Where must we go? What are the values by which we can
order our lives? The values by which we can educate our young, without
giving them norms they may be unable to resist, or demanding of them
things that perhaps should not be imposed upon them?" the pope said.

A motif of life overcoming difficult trials figured in Benedict's
earlier Good Friday homily, as he sought to encourage survivors of
Italy's devastating quake to cling to hope and take solace in Easter's
joy. The temblor in the central Apennine mountain region of Abruzzo
claimed at least 293 lives and left 40,000 people homeless." [Frances
D'Emilio, Pope carries Easter candle in Vatican basilica, Journal
Gazette And Times-Courier 2009.4.11 2045 hours CDT]

Although the ecclesiastical Easter 2009 comments by Cardinal George Pell
in conjunction with Pope Benedict, deploy similar semantics as
figurative idioms, they are oppressive of the autonomic right under the
State: "From the beginning, Christianity has understood itself as the
religion of the "Logos," as the religion according to reason.

So when the Belgium’s ambassador to the Holy See lodged a formal protest
at the ridiculousness of the Papal statements on condom effectiveness as
AIDS prevention on Wednesday 2009.4.15, prompting the Vatican
Secretariat to issue its tough statement denouncing the Belgian vote.

The Vatican deplored "the fact that a parliamentary assembly should have
thought it appropriate to criticize the Holy Father on the basis of an
isolated extract from an interview, separated from its context."

It said Benedict’s remarks to reporters had been "used by some groups
with a clear intent to intimidate, as if to dissuade the pope from
expressing himself on certain themes of obvious moral relevance and from
teaching the church’s doctrine." [Additional reporting 2009.4.18 by
Nicole Winfield, Associated Press Writer]

The reason for this, is that "in the first place, the Church has not
identified its precursors in the other religions, but in that
philosophical enlightenment which has cleared the path of traditions to
turn to the search of the truth and towards the good, toward the one God
who is above all gods. In so far as religion of the persecuted, in so
far as universal religion, beyond the different states and peoples, it
has denied the state the right to regard religion as a part of state
ordering, thus postulating the freedom of faith. It has always defined
men, all men without distinction, as creatures and images of God,
proclaiming for them, in terms of principle, although within the
imperative limits of social ordering, the same dignity." [Cardinal
Ratzinger (Pope Benedict) 1 April 2005 at convent of Saint Scholastica
in Subiaco, Italy, the day before Pope John Paul II died]

"And Nadav {free and voluntary gift; prince} and Avihu {he is my
father}, the sons of Aharon {a teacher; lofty; mountain of strength},
each took his censer, and put fire in them, and put incense on each, and
brought before G-d a strange fire, which He had not commanded them. And
a fire went out from before G-d and consumed them, and they died before
G-d." [Leviticus 10:1-2]

When we read this Torah portion, it is natural to be perplexed. What did
these sons of Aharon do that was so wrong? Why did they deserve to die?

Concerning their actions there is considerable debate. Some commentaries
say that they took fire from the altar, while others say that they made
their own. Did they proceed to the inner altar, or only the outer? Did
this tragedy begin before fire descended upon the altar [Leviticus
9:24], or after?

The answer to these question given by the sapient literature, is that
such judgment was consequential to the actions perpetuated by "...the
most ignorant of persons who don't have the intelligence of men, and
haven't learned wisdom and don't know the knowledge of holy men"--And as
derision asks:

Who has gone up to heaven and come down? And who has grasped the wind in
his hands?

And who has wrapped water in a cloak?

And who has established the limits of the earth?

What is his name?

And what is his son's name, if you know? {ie. remembering these are the
words of Agur {stranger; gathered together} son of Yaqeh {obedient;
blameless} who received prophecy and the man says to Ithiel {sign, or
coming of God}, to Ithiel and Ukal {power, prevalency}. [Proverbs 30:1]}

All these words of God are tried and he helps those who trust in him.

Do not add to his words, lest he rebuke you and you are proved false.

Two things I ask of you, do not withhold (them) from me before I die:
deceit and the lying word remove from me; poverty or riches do not give
me, supply me with bread enough for me, lest I have plenty and deny and
say: 'Who is God?'

And lest I be impoverished and steal and profane the name of God." [(c)
1991 The Order of Saint Benedict, Aramaic Targum Proverbs 30:2-9]

Concerning the source of their error, however, there seem to be only two
primary opinions. One is that they went in having drunk wine, if not
intoxicated {ie. Pissed as neuters: Render ineffective; deprive of vigor
or force; Their incoherence over substantia does no-one any favors!}.
The evidence for this view is that the remaining Cohanim, Aharon and his
other sons, were warned immediately thereafter not to enter the
Tabernacle after drinking intoxicating beverages [Leviticus 10:9]."
[Copyright 2009 and courtesy Parshas Shemini, by Rabbi Yaakov Menken,
Project Genesis]

I had, on Good Friday 2009.4.10 and prior to Cardinal George Pell's
condom effectiveness media statements regarding stemming the rate of
AIDS infection rate within Catholic Philippines, in comparison to that
of Thailand which, he said, was struggling to cope with an epidemic of
the disease. Mentioned to a friend of mine, that a circular jewelry case
from 206 BCE (pre Han Dynasty of 206 BCE to 220 CE) has a relationship
to Baal-Poer and planetary deity worship prohibition given by the Torah
from the 50th Jubilee as recorded in Deuteronomy Chapter 4: "Now, O
Israel, listen to the statutes and the judgments which I teach you to
observe, that you may live, and go in and possess the land which the
LORD God of your fathers is giving you.

You shall not add to the word which I command you, nor take anything
from it, that you may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I
command you.

Your eyes have seen what the LORD did at BAAL-POER; for the LORD your
God has destroyed from among you all the men who followed BAAL-POER.

But you who held fast to the LORD your God are alive today, every one of
you.

For what great nation is there that has God so near to it, as the LORD
our God is to us, for whatever reason we may call upon him?

And what great nation is there that has such statutes and righteous
judgments as are in all this law which I set before you this day?"
[Deuteronomy 4:1-4, 7-8 (NKJV) (c) Thomas Nelson Inc 1982]

The substantiation for Jesus cosmological and adultery discourse with
the religious teachers of his age {ie. 'the religious
'rulers-kosmokrater of the obscurity-skotos of this age-aion' engaging
in 'spiritual-pneumatikos wickedness-porneia' [Ephesians 6:12]} can be
found in the Torah and explained in metaphysical terms {ie. the #237 -
USE OF FORCE, ITS RELATION TO AUTONOMIC RIGHT UNDER THE STATE, and
CHRISTIAN IDENTITY} as a technology for managing MARRIAGE.

Wakeup to your selves! Since when does Christian identity promulgate
treason? Both Cardinal Pell and Pope Benedict are somewhat ambiguous in
relation to statements concerning condom usage and religious rights
under the state. As to whether the church is being unrepentant,
viciously fascist and disingenuous in its double-speak as the denial of
the autonomic right to regulative free-will by which to express
religious belief and values under the state.
Barry
2009-04-26 02:35:40 UTC
Permalink
Come on Dolf! That was years ago!

Main Entry:
letters patent
Function:
noun plural
Date:
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
dolf
2009-04-26 03:16:19 UTC
Permalink
Barry as an atheist, are you now claiming a religious perspective on Gay
marriage?

Barry OGrady I don't have any time for computer based games, never have,
and nor do I consent to being autonomic right being impugned by
artificial contrivance as assault and assailing by words.
Post by Barry
So anyway, after my 2009.4.9 letter to ANZ Bank, "to deny your
Institution
Post by Barry
and its employees, any satisfaction which they may otherwise derive
from
Post by Barry
an autonomic or hymeneal claim to religious belief including Christian
identity"
Come on Dolf! That was years ago!
letters patent
noun plural
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
Come on Dolf! That was years ago!
The GRAPPLE paradigm as a Balanced Ternary Distributed System, maps to
the Chinese DAOist (#81 element, ternary number theory) and I-Ching (H64
elements as binary apparatus) to produce by extrusion, Hebrew and other
language based categories of understanding by deploying this in
conjunction with a chronological syllogism, or logical appeal: [Greek:
syllismos meaning ‘conclusion,’ ‘inference’], where usually the
categorical syllogism—such as: "No servant can serve two masters: for
either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to
the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

And the Pharisees also, who were covetous, heard all these things: and
they derided him."

As a kind of logical argument in which one proposition as the conclusion
or Telos [#2187 = 37 or 'oth cycle: #2184 / #6000 = 122J3W1D] is
inferred from two others [the major premise: which contains the law of
that will as 7 x 24 x 13 = 2184 days of the 'oth cycle] and [the minor
premise: which contains the command to behave in accordance with the
law, that is, the principle of subsumption under the law: x 49 = 6J or
294 x 364 days or 365.2425 x 293 years - Vernal Equinox Wednesday 20
March] of a certain form.

THE BIBLICAL COSMOLOGY (AS 10 COMMANDMENTS) IS ASSOCIATED TO A BALANCED
TERNARY DISTRIBUTED SYSTEM

"And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men;
but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men
is abomination in the sight of God.

The law and the prophets were until John {the grace or mercy of the
Lord}: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man
presseth into it."

#1 = [the major premise {YANG/FATHER/HEAVEN/MALE/FORM - Formula of
Universal Law}, which contains the law of that will:

7 x 24 x 13 = 2184 days of the 'oth cycle = 6D or 6 x 364 associated to
the 'constant sequence of sun and moon' as 354 x 3 + 30 day
intercalation = 1092 days x 2 = 2184 days] +

#2 = [the minor premise {YIN/MOTHER/EARTH/FEMALE/MATTER - Formula of
Humanity - HEAD OF STATE}, which contains the command to behave in
accordance with the law, that is, the principle of subsumption under the
law:

x 49 = 6J or 294 x 364 days or 365.2425 x 293 years - Vernal Equinox
Wednesday 20 March 1996 / 21 March = 1 Nisan 5756; and] +

#3 = [the conclusion {ZHUN/SON/SEA/ENUMERATE/OFFSPRING - Formula of
Autonomy}, which contains the verdict (sentence), that is laid down as
right in the case at hand: ... 6,000 topical years as Telos ('achariyth
as 122J3W1D) = Arch (re'shiyth as 3W1D) + c² [9(9²+1)/2]:

has #369 with Septet #41 {ie. #81 - #27 - #9 - #3 - #1} centric on {ie.
20 March 1996 + (5*364) + 182 = 12 Sept 2001 as 1st day of 7th solar
month = #0 - Zero point} 13-17 September 2001 / 18 September = 1 Tishri
5762. ref: "On [Sunday 16 September as] the 1st day of the [21st
priestly] course of Jachin {he that strengthens and makes steadfast} on
the 29th day of lunar month, on the 5th day of the 7th solar month."
[4Q321]] +

#4 = 'OTH Chronological Elements = #10 as {Totality of Nature = Formula
of Progression of individual phenomena: #1 = {0: 1} + #2 = {0: -1, 1: 1}
+ #3 = {0: 0, 1: 1} + #4 = {0: 1, 1: 1} = #10 = {0: 1, 1: 0, 2: 1}}

vCube Balanced Ternary System distribution: #1 = {0: 1}; #41 = {0: -1,
1: -1, 2: -1, 3: -1, 4: 1}; #81 = (0: 0, 1: 0, 2:0, 3:0, 4:1}

ONE: 1, 2, 3
TWO: 0, 3, 6
THREE: 0, 9, 18
FOUR: 0, 27, 54 = Chinese Tetragramation (Yang, Yin, Zhun) of Number
(Imperial Governance of male - dragon, female (consort) - phoenix: 206
BCE to 220 CE published 2 BCE); cf: [Deuteronomy 4:1-20]
FIVE: 0, 81, 369 = 9(9²+1)/2 - Organisation of the Myriad of things
SIX: 0, 243, 729 = Appraisals within vCube (9 x 9 x 9)
SEVEN: 0, 729, 2187 = 17 March (Saint Patrick's Day) + 2 x 'OTH CYCLE
of 1092 (6 x 364 = 6D) days as Genesis and substantiation of Christian
identity.

"And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass [1 John 5:7], than one
tittle of the law to fail: "In his first audience at the Vatican since
his divorce from Diana, Princess of Wales, the Prince was expected to
receive a gift of a "luxury facsimile" of an appeal to Pope Clement VII
in 1530 CE in which English peers asked for the annulment of Henry
VIII’s marriage to Catherine of Aragon.

This follows after the Telegraph.co.uk Online Newspaper had in the first
week of April reported, that the words "Willyam Thomas, I pray yow pray
for me your lovyng master: Prynce Henry" are from a prayer roll once
belonging to the teenage Henry, who gave the roll to William Thomas, one
of his personal servants in his Privy Chamber, some time between 1505
and 1509 CE, when Henry was the Prince of Wales.

That we are able to determine whether the Monarch was a godly man by
measuring the chronological steeping to the Grapple Homoiotic Noumenon
as intellectual property and hypostatic metashematizo of homoousion. The
prayer roll will be shown in public for the first time at the British
Library's exhibition Henry VIII: Man and Monarch, which opens later this
month and marks the 500th anniversary of Henry's accession to the
throne. [Copyright and Courtesy Roya Nikkhah, Arts Correspondent,
Telegraph.co.uk 2009.4.4: Exciting discovery reveals Henry VIII as firm
believer in Catholicism]

Pope Benedict XVI, drawing on the analogy of an earthquake that had
several days earlier, struck the Italian Abruzzo region severely
damaging many churches, said "there is another 'ruin' that is far more
serious [to] that of people and communities! Like Francis [of Assisi (c.
1181-1226)], always start with yourselves. We are the first house that
God wants to restore.

If you are always able to renew yourselves in the spirit of the Gospel,
you will continue to assist the pastors of the Church to make more and
more beautiful the Church's face, that of the bride of Christ. The Pope,
now the same as then, expects this of you... Now go and bring to all the
peace and love of Christ the Saviour. May Mary Immaculate, 'Virgin made
Church', accompany you always. And may my Apostolic Blessing, which I
cordially impart to all of you here present, and the entire Franciscan
family, support you as well." [(c) 2009 Zenit News Agency 2009.4.20,
ZE09042008, Benedict XVI's Castel Gandolfo address to the Franciscan
Family: Attracting Christian Men and Women of All Ages]

The original appeal attributed to a hoax in news reports of 2009.4.20,
spoke of an important document in the history of the Reformation, which
is kept in the Vatican’s secret archives. But I've repeated here the
substance of the hocus-pocus {ie. hax pax max Deus adimax: material
objections by which to undertake various transformations related to
artificial or natural phenomena} amongst the hoi-polloi who may
recognize this hoity-toity and historical impunity to the Sovereign
autonomic right to regulative freewill as the ‘right to remain silent’
and ‘presumption of innocence’ under the Commonwealth amounts to Treason.

According to reports, Benedict XVI intends the gift as a good-will
gesture to assist in the healing of relations between the Vatican and
the Church of England. But some believe the guesture originates from a
parody of the Roman Catholic liturgy of the eucharist, which contains
the phrase "Hoc est enim corpus meum". This explanation goes back to
speculations by the Anglican prelate John Tillotson (1630-1694), who
wrote in 1694: "In all probability those common juggling words of hocus
pocus are nothing else but a corruption of hoc est corpus, by way of
ridiculous imitation of the priests of the Church of Rome in their trick
of Transubstantiation."

Or it may simply be imitation Latin with no meaning, made up to impress
people: "I will speak of one man... that went about in King James his
time... who called himself, The Kings Majesties most excellent Hocus
Pocus, and so was he called, because that at the playing of every Trick,
he used to say, Hocus pocus, tontus talontus, vade celeriter jubeo, a
dark composure of words, to blind the eyes of the beholders, to make his
Trick pass the more currently without discovery, because when the eye
and the ear of the beholder are both earnestly busied, the Trick is not
so easily discovered, nor the Imposture discerned." [According to
Wikipedia Sources 2009: Thomas Ady, A Candle in the Dark, 1656]

However, it will also serve as a reminder of the schism rooted in Henry
VIII’s battles with the Holy See over the binding nature of marriage: "I
have read in Times Online that, for the occasion of the forthcoming
visit of the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall, the Pope is to
gift his illustrious visitors a fascimile of the 1530 CE appeal by
English peers to Pope Clement VII asking for the annulment of Henry
VIII's marriage to Catherine of Aragon (From the Times April 20, 'The
Pope's gift...' Richard Owen, Rome) This news is completely untrue and
has no basis whatsoever in fact. I would ask you to issue an immediate
and unambiguous denial. Yours faithfully" [Federico Lombardi S J, Holy
See Press Office, Vatican City 2009.4.20]

The Prince was the first senior member of the Royal Family to marry a
divorcée since Edward VIII [who had to abdicate in 1936 to marry the
American Wallis Simpson. The Roman Catholic Church considers marriage a
legal and sacred bond "which cannot be broken using temporal laws"]. He
will also be the first to receive a facsimile of the document from the
Pope. [Copyright and Courtesy Foreign Staff Reporters, Telegraph.co.uk
2009.4.20: Charles and Camilla to be reminded of Pope's view of divorce]

Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth
adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband
committeth adultery.'" [Luke 16:13-18 (KJV)]

International news media proffers important perspectives of this year's
Easter Sunday as Christianity's most important feast day, when the
faithful mark their belief in the resurrection of Christ after Jesus'
death by crucifixion. Zenit news agency (www.zenit.org) reflects on the
symbolism of the 2009 Easter Vigil (additional reporting syndicated by
Associated Press) which for Christians worldwide, represents God's
promise of eternal life after death, of love's triumph over death.
According to media reports from The Australian newspaper of 0619 hours
2009.4.23, "A man has died after a lump of concrete smashed through the
windscreen of his car in inner Sydney.

http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html#***@zen:1,row:5,col:4,nous:43

The 53-year-old Perth man suffered facial and head injuries when the
lump of concrete fell from a white tipper truck and hit his front
windscreen, police said.

The man was driving along South Dowling Street, in inner-city
Darlinghurst, about 1240 hours ***@zen: 1, row: 5, col: 9, nous:
21 [Super: #259 / #21 - Guiding and the Physical/ Emptying the Heart;
I-Ching: H31 - Influence; Tetra: 42 - Going to Meet, Ego: #429 / #21 -
Guiding and the Physical/ Emptying the Heart; I-Ching: H31 - Influence;
Tetra: 42 - Going to Meet] yesterday ***@zen: 2, row: 1, col: 9,
nous: 16 [Super: #348 / #22 - Point to Reversal?/ Humility's Increase;
I-Ching: H8 - Seeking Unity; Tetra: 34 - Kinship, Ego: #213 / #16 -
Being a Guide/ Returning to the Root; I-Ching: H28 - Excess; Tetra: 75 -
Failure] when he passed the truck as he drove through the Flinders
Street intersection.

He was taken to St Vincents hospital suffering fractures and internal
injuries and died during surgery about 7pm (AEST). ***@zen: 1,
row: 8, col: 4, nous: 7 [Super: #261 / #7 - Intentional Reversal/
Dimming Radiance; I-Ching: H12 - Stagnation; Tetra: 56 - Closed Mouth,
Ego: #183 / #7 - Intentional Reversal/ Dimming Radiance; I-Ching: H12 -
Stagnation; Tetra: 56 - Closed Mouth]

'Inquiries suggest the driver of the truck, which did not stop, may have
been unaware of the incident,' police said."

http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html#***@zen:5,row:1,col:9,nous:36

Benedict prayed that Christians would "shine as lights in the world"
amid "the confusions of this age" and amid the search for values to put
"order" in our lives.

"The gravitational pull of love is stronger than that of hatred; the
force of gravity of life is stronger than that of death," Benedict said
in his homily reflecting on the mystery of Christian belief in the
resurrection, in which is seen the most sublime fulfillment of what this
text describes as the beginning of all things--the Church reads the
account of creation as a prophecy. This Gospel is according to the
revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began but now made
manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures made known to all nations,
according to the commandment of the everlasting God: [Romans 16:25-26]

The Torah perspective of cosmogony associated to the Mysteries as
conveyed by the Book of Genesis appears identical to the Chinese Daoist
literature: "The Mystery of which we speak in hidden places, as dazzling
light from the infinite and fiery brilliance out of the boundless
unfolds (li or chang: 'to expand') the myriad species (categories) from
the primordial chaos as the holding place for Being, without revealing a
form of its own:

- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/tetrayear.jpg

It fashions the stuff of (ie. gives birth to and nourishes) Emptiness
and Formlessness (of the primordial chaos), giving birth to the
regulations (ie. the circular motion of the sun). Tied to the gods in
Heaven and the spirits on Earth (ie. The Way is a daemonic equivalent to
these potencies; cf: #60), it fixes the models (mo: numbers or shu:
calculations). It pervades and assimilates past and present, originating
the categories. It unfolds and intersperses yin and yang, generating the
chi'i (as the vitality which informs the entire cosmos and binds all
humans to the rest of phenomena)." [Michael Nylan, Hsuan Li (Evolution
of the Mystery), Canon of Supreme Mystery 1993:429, 64]

By a supposed lack of evidence, one or two assume we know as much that
there is to know about science and the universe. There's no doubt more
yet to be discovered, that explains the nature of the strong and weak
forces, rather than merely acknowledging their effects. It's not like
science has a theory of everything, science really is still relatively
recent on the timeline of human achievements.

"First of all," he said, "there is light": "Where there is light, life
is born, chaos can be transformed into cosmos." And in this regard
seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of light out of the
void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism: "The work of the
Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal life. God himself
is not the created light, but the Author of all light, whereof in the
divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid, which implieth
the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews affirm, that God is
fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys produceth, is the
fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate intelligences, beyond
the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity, aether. Having overcome
these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know the cohabitation of the
immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic
Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The History of Philosophy, p 573]

"The resurrection of Jesus is an eruption of light," Pope Benedict
explained. "Death is conquered, the tomb is thrown open. The Risen One
himself is Light, the Light of the world. With the resurrection, the
Lord’s day enters the nights of history. This statement is especially
pertinent, given the possibility of exhuming of Australian War dead in
French and European battlefronts. That the internment {as repatriation
to named graves}, isn't necessarily in keeping with the religious value
of their philosophical beliefs made under the Commonwealth, of such
immortals dwelling in eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free
forever more abounding as dawning light upon the morn.

Pope Benedict said, "Beginning with the resurrection, God’s light
spreads throughout the world and throughout history. Day dawns. This
Light alone -- Jesus Christ -- is the true light, something more than
the physical phenomenon of light. He is pure Light: God himself, who
causes a new creation to be born in the midst of the old, transforming
chaos into cosmos."

According to a chapter titled 'Sciences preparative to Philosophy' on
page 523 of the 1687 CE fascimile edition of the History of Philosophy,
the onomantick number doctrine of Pythagoras considered Number as
propositionally an Intellectual Property of the Divine Mind : "Number is
of two kinds, the Intellectual (immaterial: ecclesiastical and
sapiental) and the Sciental (ternary quantitative: measured and weighed,
having magnitude or spatial extent). The Intellectual is that eternal
substance of Number, which Pythagoras in his Discourse concerning the
Gods asserted to be the principle most providential of all Heaven and
Earth, and the nature that is betwixt them. Moreover, it is the root of
Divine Beings, and of Gods, and of Daemons.

This is that which he termed the principle, fountain, and root of all
things, and defined it to be that which before all things exists in the
Divine Mind; from which and out of which all things are digested into
order, and remain numbered by an indossoluble series [as hierarchy].

For all things which are ordered in the world by nature according to an
artificial course in part and in whole, appear to be distinguished and
adorned by Providence and the All-creating Mind, according to Number;
the Exemplar being established by applying (as the reason of the
principle before the impression of things) the number pre-existent in
the Intellect of God, maker of the world. This only in intellectual, and
wholly immaterial, really a substance according to which as being the
most exact artificial reason {eg: COMMONWEALTH and its technological
(Deus ex machinas) relationship to the Grapple Homoiotic Noumenon as
intellectual property and hypostatic metashematizo of homoousion}, all
things are perfected: Time, Heaven, Motion, the Stars, and their various
revolutions." [Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th
Section, 1687 edition, The History of Philosophy, p 523]

"At the Easter Vigil," the Pontiff said, "the Church represents the
mystery of the light of Christ in the sign of the Paschal candle, whose
flame is both light and heat. The symbolism of light is connected with
that of fire: radiance and heat, radiance and the transforming energy
contained in the fire -- truth and love go together. The Paschal candle
burns, and is thereby consumed: The cross and the resurrection are
inseparable."

Benedict XVI said that the second symbol, water, has "two opposed
meanings": On the one hand there is the sea, which appears as a force
antagonistic to life on earth, continually threatening it; yet God has
placed a limit upon it. Hence the book of Revelation says that in God’s
new world, the sea will be no more. It is the element of death. And so
it becomes the symbolic representation of Jesus’ death on the Cross:
Christ descended into the sea, into the waters of death, as Israel did
into the Red Sea. Having risen from death, he gives us life.

This means that baptism is not only a cleansing, but a new birth: with
Christ we, as it were, descend into the sea of death, so as to rise up
again as new creatures.

He said the other "way in which we encounter water is in the form of the
fresh spring that gives life, or the great river from which life comes
forth." Yet within Oriental and Occidental Sapiental literature in which
the seasonal garden [Genesis 2:8-14] is a metaphor for the governing of
empire: "A large state is the lower reaches of a river: The place where
all the streams of the world unite. In the union of the world, the
female always gets the better of the male by stillness. Being still, she
takes the lower position. Hence the large state, by taking the lower
position, annexes the small state; The small state, by taking the lower
position, affiliates itself to the large state." [DAO TE CHING #61 -
Virtuosity at Using 'Beneath'/ Virtue of Humility; I-Ching: H64 - Before
Completion; Tetra: #78 - On the Verge]

"Without water there is no life," the Pontiff affirmed. "It is striking
how much importance is attached to wells in sacred Scripture. They are
places from which life rises forth. Beside Jacob’s well, Christ spoke to
the Samaritan woman of the new well, the water of true life."

"The reason why the River and the Sea are able to be king of the hundred
valleys is that they excel in taking the lower position. Hence they are
able to be king of the hundred valleys. Therefore, desiring to rule over
the people, One must in one's words humble oneself before them; And,
desiring to lead the people, One must, in one's person, follow behind
them. Therefore the sage takes his place over the people yet is no
burden; takes his place ahead of the people yet causes no obstruction.
That is why the empire supports him joyfully and never tires of doing
so. It is because he does not contend that no one in the empire is in a
position to contend with him." [DAO TE CHING #66 - Strategic Reversal/
Putting Oneself Behind; I-Ching: H41 - Decrease; Tetra: #55 - Diminishment]

Benedict XVI then reflected on the third symbol, "the singing of the new
song -- the alleluia."

"When a person experiences great joy, he cannot keep it to himself," he
explained. "He has to express it, to pass it on. But what happens when a
person is touched by the light of the resurrection, and thus comes into
contact with Life itself, with Truth and Love? He cannot merely speak
about it. Speech is no longer adequate. He has to sing."

"At the Easter Vigil, year after year, we Christians intone this song
after the third reading, we sing it as our song, because we too, through
God’s power, have been drawn forth from the water and liberated for true
life," he said.

Recalling the story from the Bible when Moses sang a song after Israel's
liberation from Egypt, the Pope said the "image describes the situation
of the disciples of Jesus Christ in every age, the situation of the
Church in the history of this world."

"Humanly speaking, it is self-contradictory," he explained. "On the one
hand, the community is located at the Exodus, in the midst of the Red
Sea, in a sea which is paradoxically ice and fire at the same time."
[Zenit News Agency, 'Pontiff: Church will never Sink', ZE09041207 -
2009-04-12]

Benedict said Jesus, like a shepherd, gave guidance to his flock. "What
great compassion he must feel in our own time too – on account of all
the endless talk that people hide behind, while in reality they are
totally confused. Where must we go? What are the values by which we can
order our lives? The values by which we can educate our young, without
giving them norms they may be unable to resist, or demanding of them
things that perhaps should not be imposed upon them?" the pope said.

A motif of life overcoming difficult trials figured in Benedict's
earlier Good Friday homily, as he sought to encourage survivors of
Italy's devastating quake to cling to hope and take solace in Easter's
joy. The temblor in the central Apennine mountain region of Abruzzo
claimed at least 293 lives and left 40,000 people homeless." [Frances
D'Emilio, Pope carries Easter candle in Vatican basilica, Journal
Gazette And Times-Courier 2009.4.11 2045 hours CDT]

Although the ecclesiastical Easter 2009 comments by Cardinal George Pell
in conjunction with Pope Benedict, deploy similar semantics as
figurative idioms, they are oppressive of the autonomic right under the
State: "From the beginning, Christianity has understood itself as the
religion of the "Logos," as the religion according to reason.

So when the Belgium’s ambassador to the Holy See lodged a formal protest
at the ridiculousness of the Papal statements on condom effectiveness as
AIDS prevention on Wednesday 2009.4.15, prompting the Vatican
Secretariat to issue its tough statement denouncing the Belgian vote.

The Vatican deplored "the fact that a parliamentary assembly should have
thought it appropriate to criticize the Holy Father on the basis of an
isolated extract from an interview, separated from its context."

It said Benedict’s remarks to reporters had been "used by some groups
with a clear intent to intimidate, as if to dissuade the pope from
expressing himself on certain themes of obvious moral relevance and from
teaching the church’s doctrine." [Additional reporting 2009.4.18 by
Nicole Winfield, Associated Press Writer]

The reason for this, is that "in the first place, the Church has not
identified its precursors in the other religions, but in that
philosophical enlightenment which has cleared the path of traditions to
turn to the search of the truth and towards the good, toward the one God
who is above all gods. In so far as religion of the persecuted, in so
far as universal religion, beyond the different states and peoples, it
has denied the state the right to regard religion as a part of state
ordering, thus postulating the freedom of faith. It has always defined
men, all men without distinction, as creatures and images of God,
proclaiming for them, in terms of principle, although within the
imperative limits of social ordering, the same dignity." [Cardinal
Ratzinger (Pope Benedict) 1 April 2005 at convent of Saint Scholastica
in Subiaco, Italy, the day before Pope John Paul II died]

"And Nadav {free and voluntary gift; prince} and Avihu {he is my
father}, the sons of Aharon {a teacher; lofty; mountain of strength},
each took his censer, and put fire in them, and put incense on each, and
brought before G-d a strange fire, which He had not commanded them. And
a fire went out from before G-d and consumed them, and they died before
G-d." [Leviticus 10:1-2]

When we read this Torah portion, it is natural to be perplexed. What did
these sons of Aharon do that was so wrong? Why did they deserve to die?

Concerning their actions there is considerable debate. Some commentaries
say that they took fire from the altar, while others say that they made
their own. Did they proceed to the inner altar, or only the outer? Did
this tragedy begin before fire descended upon the altar [Leviticus
9:24], or after?

The answer to these question given by the sapient literature, is that
such judgment was consequential to the actions perpetuated by "...the
most ignorant of persons who don't have the intelligence of men, and
haven't learned wisdom and don't know the knowledge of holy men"--And as
derision asks:

Who has gone up to heaven and come down? And who has grasped the wind in
his hands?

And who has wrapped water in a cloak?

And who has established the limits of the earth?

What is his name?

And what is his son's name, if you know? {ie. remembering these are the
words of Agur {stranger; gathered together} son of Yaqeh {obedient;
blameless} who received prophecy and the man says to Ithiel {sign, or
coming of God}, to Ithiel and Ukal {power, prevalency}. [Proverbs 30:1]}

All these words of God are tried and he helps those who trust in him.

Do not add to his words, lest he rebuke you and you are proved false.

Two things I ask of you, do not withhold (them) from me before I die:
deceit and the lying word remove from me; poverty or riches do not give
me, supply me with bread enough for me, lest I have plenty and deny and
say: 'Who is God?'

And lest I be impoverished and steal and profane the name of God." [(c)
1991 The Order of Saint Benedict, Aramaic Targum Proverbs 30:2-9]

Concerning the source of their error, however, there seem to be only two
primary opinions. One is that they went in having drunk wine, if not
intoxicated {ie. Pissed as neuters: Render ineffective; deprive of vigor
or force; Their incoherence over substantia does no-one any favors!}.
The evidence for this view is that the remaining Cohanim, Aharon and his
other sons, were warned immediately thereafter not to enter the
Tabernacle after drinking intoxicating beverages [Leviticus 10:9]."
[Copyright 2009 and courtesy Parshas Shemini, by Rabbi Yaakov Menken,
Project Genesis]

I had, on Good Friday 2009.4.10 and prior to Cardinal George Pell's
condom effectiveness media statements regarding stemming the rate of
AIDS infection rate within Catholic Philippines, in comparison to that
of Thailand which, he said, was struggling to cope with an epidemic of
the disease. Mentioned to a friend of mine, that a circular jewelry case
from 206 BCE (pre Han Dynasty of 206 BCE to 220 CE) has a relationship
to Baal-Poer and planetary deity worship prohibition given by the Torah
from the 50th Jubilee as recorded in Deuteronomy Chapter 4: "Now, O
Israel, listen to the statutes and the judgments which I teach you to
observe, that you may live, and go in and possess the land which the
LORD God of your fathers is giving you.

You shall not add to the word which I command you, nor take anything
from it, that you may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I
command you.

Your eyes have seen what the LORD did at BAAL-POER; for the LORD your
God has destroyed from among you all the men who followed BAAL-POER.

But you who held fast to the LORD your God are alive today, every one of
you.

For what great nation is there that has God so near to it, as the LORD
our God is to us, for whatever reason we may call upon him?

And what great nation is there that has such statutes and righteous
judgments as are in all this law which I set before you this day?"
[Deuteronomy 4:1-4, 7-8 (NKJV) (c) Thomas Nelson Inc 1982]

The substantiation for Jesus cosmological and adultery discourse with
the religious teachers of his age {ie. 'the religious
'rulers-kosmokrater of the obscurity-skotos of this age-aion' engaging
in 'spiritual-pneumatikos wickedness-porneia' [Ephesians 6:12]} can be
found in the Torah and explained in metaphysical terms {ie. the #237 -
USE OF FORCE, ITS RELATION TO AUTONOMIC RIGHT UNDER THE STATE, and
CHRISTIAN IDENTITY} as a technology for managing MARRIAGE.

Wakeup to your selves! Since when does Christian identity promulgate
treason? Both Cardinal Pell and Pope Benedict are somewhat ambiguous in
relation to statements concerning condom usage and religious rights
under the state. As to whether the church is being unrepentant,
viciously fascist and disingenuous in its double-speak as the denial of
the autonomic right to regulative free-will by which to express
religious belief and values under the state.
Barry
2009-04-25 08:00:40 UTC
Permalink
Say Dolt, are you a member of the Westboro Baptist Church?

They hate everyone just like you.

Join up here. http://www.godhatesfags.com
dolf
2009-04-26 00:03:52 UTC
Permalink
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.

And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
light out of the void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism:
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]

The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, “that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.”

- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/herald.jpg
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.

The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].

- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Post by Barry
Say Dolt, are you a member of the Westboro Baptist Church?
They hate everyone just like you.
Join up here. http://www.godhatesfags.com
Barry
2009-04-26 01:00:45 UTC
Permalink
Main Entry:
letters patent
Function:
noun plural
Date:
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
bob young
2009-04-25 07:30:08 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.
No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
dolf
2009-04-26 00:03:28 UTC
Permalink
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.

And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
light out of the void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism:
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]

The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, “that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.”

- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/herald.jpg
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.

The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].

- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.
No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
Barry
2009-04-26 01:00:28 UTC
Permalink
Main Entry:
letters patent
Function:
noun plural
Date:
14th century
: a writing (as from a sovereign) that confers on a designated person a
grant in a form open for public inspection
bob young
2009-04-26 08:13:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by dolf
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.
And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]
The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, ‭that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.”
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/herald.jpg
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.
The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].
- dolf
Excuse me dolf, in your estimation,
what percentage of posters here would have the stamina
to wade through all of that ?

Particularly since, after a 'speed read', it all seems to amount to a big fat zero.
Apparently your English teacher was not one for
keeping his students divorced from the obtuse and verbose !

Do you have any 'four liners' that mean anything, such as -

Theology

The effort to explain the unknowable
in terms of the not worth knowing

H. L. Mencken
Post by dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.
No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
dolf
2009-04-26 09:18:44 UTC
Permalink
I know enough English to understand that 'Excuse me' is the closest to
an apology you'll get from an American.

"I don't have any time for torturous computer based games, never have,
and nor do I consent to my autonomic Natural and Common Law right being
impugned by artificial contrivance as assault and assailing by words."

- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Post by bob young
Excuse me dolf, in your estimation,
what percentage of posters here would have the stamina
to wade through all of that ?
Particularly since, after a 'speed read', it all seems to amount to a big fat zero.
Apparently your English teacher was not one for
keeping his students divorced from the obtuse and verbose !
Do you have any 'four liners' that mean anything, such as -
Theology
The effort to explain the unknowable
in terms of the not worth knowing
H. L. Mencken
By a supposed lack of evidence, one or two assume we know as much that
there is to know about science and the universe. There's no doubt more
yet to be discovered, that explains the nature of the strong and weak
forces, rather than merely acknowledging their effects. It's not like
science has a theory of everything, science really is still relatively
recent on the timeline of human achievements.

"First of all," he said, "there is light": "Where there is light, life
is born, chaos can be transformed into cosmos." And in this regard
seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of light out of the
void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism: "The work of the
Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal life. God himself
is not the created light, but the Author of all light, whereof in the
divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid, which implieth
the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews affirm, that God is
fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys produceth, is the
fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate intelligences, beyond
the visible Heaven, termed aion, age, eternity, aether {ie. the
religious teachers as rulers-kosmokrater of the obscurity-skotos of this
age-aion' engaging in 'spiritual-pneumatikos wickedness-porneia'
[Ephesians 6:12]}. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou
shalt know the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man."
[Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687
edition, The History of Philosophy, p 573]

"The resurrection of Jesus is an eruption of light," Pope Benedict
explained. "Death is conquered, the tomb is thrown open. The Risen One
himself is Light, the Light of the world. With the resurrection, the
Lord’s day enters the nights of history. This statement is especially
pertinent, given the possibility of the exhuming of Australian War dead
in French and European battlefronts. That the internment {as
repatriation to named graves}, isn't necessarily in keeping with the
religious value of their philosophical beliefs made under the
Commonwealth, of such immortals dwelling in eternity--their virtue
remains, spirits free forever more abounding as dawning light upon the morn.

Pope Benedict said, "Beginning with the resurrection, God’s light
spreads throughout the world and throughout history. Day dawns. This
Light alone -- Jesus Christ -- is the true light, something more than
the physical phenomenon of light. He is pure Light: God himself, who
causes a new creation to be born in the midst of the old, transforming
chaos into cosmos."

According to a chapter titled 'Sciences preparative to Philosophy' on
page 523 of the 1687 CE fascimile edition of the History of Philosophy,
the onomantick number-heteros (marriage) doctrine of Pythagoras
considered Number as propositionally an Intellectual Property of the
Divine Mind: "Number is of two kinds, the Intellectual (immaterial:
ecclesiastical and sapiental) and the Sciental (ternary quantitative:
measured and weighed, having magnitude or spatial extent). The
Intellectual is that eternal substance of Number, which Pythagoras in
his Discourse concerning the Gods asserted to be the principle most
providential of all Heaven and Earth, and the nature that is betwixt
them. Moreover, it is the root of Divine Beings, and of Gods, and of
Daemons.

This is that which he termed the principle, fountain, and root of all
things, and defined it to be that which before all things exists in the
Divine Mind; from which and out of which all things are digested into
order, and remain numbered by an indissoluble series {ie. as hierarchy:
"And this is the inscription: MENE, MENE, TEKEL, UPHARSIN. This is the
interpretation of each. MENE: God has numbered your kingdom, and
finished it; TEKEL: You have been weighed in the balances, and found
wanting; PERES: Your kingdom has been divided, and given to the Medes
{measure; habit; covering} and the Persians {that cuts or divides; a
nail; a gryphon; a horseman}." [Daniel 5:25-28]}

For all things which are ordered in the world by nature according to an
artificial course in part and in whole, appear to be distinguished and
adorned by Providence and the All-creating Mind, according to Number;
the Exemplar being established by applying (as the reason of the
principle before the impression of things) the number pre-existent in
the Intellect of God, maker of the world. This only in intellectual, and
wholly immaterial, really a substance according to which as being the
most exact artificial reason {eg: COMMONWEALTH and its technological
(Deus ex machinas) relationship to the Grapple Homoiotic Noumenon as
intellectual property and hypostatic metashematizo of homoousion}, all
things are perfected: Time, Heaven, Motion, the Stars, and their various
revolutions." [Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th
Section, 1687 edition, The History of Philosophy, p 523]

"At the Easter Vigil," the Pontiff said, "the Church represents the
mystery of the light of Christ in the sign of the Paschal candle, whose
flame is both light and heat. The symbolism of light is connected with
that of fire: radiance and heat, radiance and the transforming energy
contained in the fire -- truth and love go together. The Paschal candle
burns, and is thereby consumed: The cross and the resurrection are
inseparable."
Post by bob young
Post by dolf
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.
And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]
The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, β�­that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.�
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/herald.jpg
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.
The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].
- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.
No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
bob young
2009-04-27 12:24:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by dolf
I know enough English to understand that 'Excuse me' is the closest to
an apology you'll get from an American.
Well thanks for the compliment,
but in actual fact I hail from the same town as Isaac Newton
and my opening gambit was not intended as an apology, simply a wake up call
Post by dolf
"I don't have any time for torturous computer based games, never have,
and nor do I consent to my autonomic Natural and Common Law right being
impugned by artificial contrivance as assault and assailing by words."
- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Post by bob young
Excuse me dolf, in your estimation,
what percentage of posters here would have the stamina
to wade through all of that ?
Particularly since, after a 'speed read', it all seems to amount to a big fat zero.
Apparently your English teacher was not one for
keeping his students divorced from the obtuse and verbose !
Do you have any 'four liners' that mean anything, such as -
Theology
The effort to explain the unknowable
in terms of the not worth knowing
H. L. Mencken
By a supposed lack of evidence, one or two assume we know as much that
there is to know about science and the universe. There's no doubt more
yet to be discovered, that explains the nature of the strong and weak
forces, rather than merely acknowledging their effects. It's not like
science has a theory of everything, science really is still relatively
recent on the timeline of human achievements.
"First of all," he said, "there is light": "Where there is light, life
is born, chaos can be transformed into cosmos." And in this regard
seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of light out of the
void, formlessness is distinct to Hymeneal Mysticism: "The work of the
Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal life. God himself
is not the created light, but the Author of all light, whereof in the
divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid, which implieth
the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews affirm, that God is
fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys produceth, is the
fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate intelligences, beyond
the visible Heaven, termed aion, age, eternity, aether {ie. the
religious teachers as rulers-kosmokrater of the obscurity-skotos of this
age-aion' engaging in 'spiritual-pneumatikos wickedness-porneia'
[Ephesians 6:12]}. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou
shalt know the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man."
[Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687
edition, The History of Philosophy, p 573]
"The resurrection of Jesus is an eruption of light," Pope Benedict
explained. "Death is conquered, the tomb is thrown open. The Risen One
himself is Light, the Light of the world. With the resurrection, the
Lord’s day enters the nights of history. This statement is especially
pertinent, given the possibility of the exhuming of Australian War dead
in French and European battlefronts. That the internment {as
repatriation to named graves}, isn't necessarily in keeping with the
religious value of their philosophical beliefs made under the
Commonwealth, of such immortals dwelling in eternity--their virtue
remains, spirits free forever more abounding as dawning light upon the morn.
Pope Benedict said, "Beginning with the resurrection, God’s light
spreads throughout the world and throughout history. Day dawns. This
Light alone -- Jesus Christ -- is the true light, something more than
the physical phenomenon of light. He is pure Light: God himself, who
causes a new creation to be born in the midst of the old, transforming
chaos into cosmos."
According to a chapter titled 'Sciences preparative to Philosophy' on
page 523 of the 1687 CE fascimile edition of the History of Philosophy,
the onomantick number-heteros (marriage) doctrine of Pythagoras
considered Number as propositionally an Intellectual Property of the
measured and weighed, having magnitude or spatial extent). The
Intellectual is that eternal substance of Number, which Pythagoras in
his Discourse concerning the Gods asserted to be the principle most
providential of all Heaven and Earth, and the nature that is betwixt
them. Moreover, it is the root of Divine Beings, and of Gods, and of
Daemons.
This is that which he termed the principle, fountain, and root of all
things, and defined it to be that which before all things exists in the
Divine Mind; from which and out of which all things are digested into
"And this is the inscription: MENE, MENE, TEKEL, UPHARSIN. This is the
interpretation of each. MENE: God has numbered your kingdom, and
finished it; TEKEL: You have been weighed in the balances, and found
wanting; PERES: Your kingdom has been divided, and given to the Medes
{measure; habit; covering} and the Persians {that cuts or divides; a
nail; a gryphon; a horseman}." [Daniel 5:25-28]}
For all things which are ordered in the world by nature according to an
artificial course in part and in whole, appear to be distinguished and
adorned by Providence and the All-creating Mind, according to Number;
the Exemplar being established by applying (as the reason of the
principle before the impression of things) the number pre-existent in
the Intellect of God, maker of the world. This only in intellectual, and
wholly immaterial, really a substance according to which as being the
most exact artificial reason {eg: COMMONWEALTH and its technological
(Deus ex machinas) relationship to the Grapple Homoiotic Noumenon as
intellectual property and hypostatic metashematizo of homoousion}, all
things are perfected: Time, Heaven, Motion, the Stars, and their various
revolutions." [Pythagoras (580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th
Section, 1687 edition, The History of Philosophy, p 523]
"At the Easter Vigil," the Pontiff said, "the Church represents the
mystery of the light of Christ in the sign of the Paschal candle, whose
flame is both light and heat. The symbolism of light is connected with
that of fire: radiance and heat, radiance and the transforming energy
contained in the fire -- truth and love go together. The Paschal candle
burns, and is thereby consumed: The cross and the resurrection are
inseparable."
Post by bob young
Post by dolf
I think this internment {as repatriation to named graves}, isn't
necessarily in keeping with the religious value of their philosophical
beliefs made under the Commonwealth, that as such immortals dwell in
eternity--their virtue remains, spirits free forever more abounding as
dawning light upon the morn.
And in this regard seventh-day sabbath belief derived from emanation of
"The work of the Mind is life, the work of God is immortality, eternal
life. God himself is not the created light, but the Author of all light,
whereof in the divine Trinity, he containeth a most absolute Pyramid,
which implieth the vigor of fire. Whence the Chaldeans and Hebrews
affirm, that God is fire. But the Pyramid which this divine Tetractys
produceth, is the fiery light of the immaterial world, of separate
intelligences, beyond the visible Heaven, termed aoin, age, eternity,
aether. Having overcome these things (saith Pythagoras) thou shalt know
the cohabitation of the immortal gods, and mortal man." [Pythagoras
(580-500 BCE), Photographic Fascimile 9th Section, 1687 edition, The
History of Philosophy, p 573]
The Herald as Official Crest (which has Kabbalistic origins) to the
Royal Prince Alfred Hospital (New South Wales) who have a tradition of
excellence since 1882, is not at all dissimilar to the Kabbalistic image
published by the German philosopher Doctor Heinrick Khunrath (1560-1605
CE) who says, Ξ²οΏ½Β­that the correct knowledge of art is 'a breath from God'
by communication with heavenly hierarchies. The influence of John Dee's
Monas Hieroglyphica (1564), an interpretation of the Pythagorean
Tetractys as seen from the perspective of magic is apparent in the
illustration.Ξ²οΏ½οΏ½
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/images/herald.jpg
That Kabbalistic Categories are shown in this Herald as Official Crest.
The Pythagoras Tetractys according to Thomas Stanley's 1687 CE History
of Philosophy, is the Divine Mind (Immortal gods) as being principles of
things or essential archai as causes produced by communicating through
the Superior World to the inferior, life, and the being (substantial
rather than accidental) of every species as the eternal Nature exempler
Idea and essence. These were considered to be differentiated number
based daemons (angels, gods), incorpreal beings, individual, spirits
void of matter, simple, unmixt, seated beyond the sensible Heaven,
confined neither to time nor place, neither suffering age nor
transmutation, much less any alteration. In a word, not being affected
with any passion, they lead a self-sufficient excellent life, and
inhabit Eternity, which is always being, because it always was, is, and
shall be intemporarly in the Divine Mind. [John Reuchlin (1455-1522 CE),
The Triple World, Chapter II, Explanation of Pythagorean Doctrine].
- dolf
- http://www.grapple.id.au/Chronicles/automata.html
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
go play with your electric train sonny
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.
No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
dolf
2009-04-25 06:08:09 UTC
Permalink
Say bob, are you acting as interfaith chaplain for the exhuming of
Australian World War I dead in France?
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by bob young
Post by Terry Cross
Post by Michael Christ
The Bible is for the unbelievers.
The Bible was written for unbelievers that they might believe the testimony
of men who came to know God.
The Bible was written [perhaps no earlier than the year 1100] ...
Heh. And Mr. Young pretends to adhere to scientific evidence!
I leave all of the pretence to the godbots, since without it they are nothing.
Worship as it fits your soul, sir. May you receive all the benefit
duly arising therefrom.
TCross
Care to define 'soul' for us Mr. Cross ?
The soul is something you deny exists, but without which your
epistemological system collapses.
Really ? Waiting
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is that which knows and decides.
No the brain does that
Post by Terry Cross
The soul is the element of
consciousness.
No that is your brain or what's left of it.
Post by Terry Cross
Without a knower, knowledge is impossible.
Clever
Post by Terry Cross
Without
knowledge, science has no meaning.
Even cleverer !
Post by Terry Cross
And without science, you yourself
are no more than slime mold
Without science we are all projected back to the dark aghes living like Stone Age men.
No gods then, we had no means to converse, gods were only invented after we could listen
to those champing at the bit trying to control others
Post by Terry Cross
In common usage, people often say they "have" a soul,
Ye they do - they have been programmed to it.
Post by Terry Cross
but that usage
is soon seen to be an eccentricity of speech rather than a core
belief.
True
Post by Terry Cross
I refer the title "Ms."
You are a Mzzzzzzz ? Sorry I will try to be more polite in future.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
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