Discussion:
Jesus was asked 183 questions, but he only answered 3 directly!
(too old to reply)
Emma
2005-09-11 14:56:24 UTC
Permalink
I found this on a website.
Interesting.....


Answers are wonderful when they are true and keep
us on the human and spiritual path. But answers are not
wonderful when they become something we have as an ego
possession, allowing us to be arrogant, falsely self assured,
and closed down as a person.

In other words, answers are a plus in the technical and
practical world, but a liability in the world of the
mysterious ways of the Spirit:

“My thoughts are not your thoughts, my ways are not your ways
As high as the heavens are from the earth so are my
thoughts above your thoughts” says Isaiah 55:8-9.

This depth and mystery to God leaves all of us as perpetual
searchers and seekers, always novices and beginners.
It is the narrow and dark way of faith.

“Search and you will find, knock and the door will be
opened to you”(Luke 11:9), says Jesus.

There is something inherently valuable about an attitude
of spiritual curiosity and persistent “knocking.”
It creates in us what the Greek philosophers and
St. Thomas Aquinas call the “cardinal” virtues:
prudence, fortitude, temperance, and justice.

These were considered the “hinge” virtues on which all
the other moral virtues hang and depend. If you study
each of these four virtues, you will see that
they each require an ongoing broadening, discerning,
balancing, and discovery of God’s will and God’s ways.
They are never virtues that you fully possess or have,
but they are always dependent on time, discernment,
prayer, and listening to others beyond your self.

They demand gradual discovery and humility, and they
refuse to be “had”! There is never any one who can say
he is perfectly prudent, always courageous and persistent,
consistently moderate and balanced, or equally just in
regard to others’ rights.

Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!

The others he either ignored, kept silent about, asked them
a question in return, changed the subject, told a story or
gave an audio visual aid to make his point, told them it was
the wrong question, revealed their insincerity or hypocrisy,
made the exactly opposite point, or redirected the question
elsewhere!

He himself asks 307 questions, which would seem to set
a pattern for imitation. Considering this, it is really
rather amazing that the church became an official answering
machine and a very self assured program for
“sin management.”

Many, if not most, of Jesus’ teaching would never pass
contemporary orthodoxy tests in either the Roman Office
or the Southern Baptist Convention. Most of his statements
are so open to misinterpretation in almost all areas
except one: his insistence upon the goodness and reliability
of God.
That was his only consistent absolute.

These are the three questions that he answered directly:

1) “So you are a king, then?” said Pilate.
“Yes, I am a king. I was born for this” (John 18:37).

2) “Lord, teach us how to pray, just as John taught
his disciples. He said to them, ‘This is how you pray,’
and he taught them the Our Father (Luke 11:1).

3) “To disconcert him, one of the Pharisees put to him a
question, ‘Master, which is the greatest commandment of the
Law?’ Jesus said, ‘You must love the Lord your God with
all your heart,with all your mind, and with all your soul…
And the second is like it” (Matthew 22:36-37).
--
*~*~*
Emma
http://www.werenotafraid.com/
*~*~*
f***@hotmail.com
2005-09-11 16:06:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Emma
I found this on a website.
Interesting.....
Answers are wonderful when they are true and keep
us on the human and spiritual path. But answers are not
wonderful when they become something we have as an ego
possession, allowing us to be arrogant, falsely self assured,
and closed down as a person.
In other words, answers are a plus in the technical and
practical world, but a liability in the world of the
"My thoughts are not your thoughts, my ways are not your ways
As high as the heavens are from the earth so are my
thoughts above your thoughts" says Isaiah 55:8-9.
This depth and mystery to God leaves all of us as perpetual
searchers and seekers, always novices and beginners.
It is the narrow and dark way of faith.
"Search and you will find, knock and the door will be
opened to you"(Luke 11:9), says Jesus.
There is something inherently valuable about an attitude
of spiritual curiosity and persistent "knocking."
It creates in us what the Greek philosophers and
prudence, fortitude, temperance, and justice.
These were considered the "hinge" virtues on which all
the other moral virtues hang and depend. If you study
each of these four virtues, you will see that
they each require an ongoing broadening, discerning,
balancing, and discovery of God's will and God's ways.
They are never virtues that you fully possess or have,
but they are always dependent on time, discernment,
prayer, and listening to others beyond your self.
They demand gradual discovery and humility, and they
refuse to be "had"! There is never any one who can say
he is perfectly prudent, always courageous and persistent,
consistently moderate and balanced, or equally just in
regard to others' rights.
Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!
The others he either ignored, kept silent about, asked them
a question in return, changed the subject, told a story or
gave an audio visual aid to make his point, told them it was
the wrong question, revealed their insincerity or hypocrisy,
made the exactly opposite point, or redirected the question
elsewhere!
He himself asks 307 questions, which would seem to set
a pattern for imitation. Considering this, it is really
rather amazing that the church became an official answering
machine and a very self assured program for
"sin management."
Many, if not most, of Jesus' teaching would never pass
contemporary orthodoxy tests in either the Roman Office
or the Southern Baptist Convention. Most of his statements
are so open to misinterpretation in almost all areas
except one: his insistence upon the goodness and reliability
of God.
That was his only consistent absolute.
1) "So you are a king, then?" said Pilate.
"Yes, I am a king. I was born for this" (John 18:37).
2) "Lord, teach us how to pray, just as John taught
his disciples. He said to them, 'This is how you pray,'
and he taught them the Our Father (Luke 11:1).
3) "To disconcert him, one of the Pharisees put to him a
question, 'Master, which is the greatest commandment of the
Law?' Jesus said, 'You must love the Lord your God with
all your heart,with all your mind, and with all your soul...
And the second is like it" (Matthew 22:36-37).
=======

As usual, Emma is posting an unBiblical propaganda piece.

First, most of the things that Jesus said were not in answer to
questions posed to him.
So Jesus' explicit words about his being the Messiah, his rising from
the dead, belief in him being necessary for salvation, etc. are ignored
in this piece.
And those explicitly stated doctrines are the ones which are most
denounced by such liberals as the author of this piece.

Second, Jesus explained that he spoke in cryptic parables to those who
were against God but he spoke openly to those who were his followers -
Mark 4:34

Third, the above piece gives the impression that there is no such thing
as hard truth, that things are really relative, that those who know the
truth and preach it are being "narrow-minded".
But Jesus said that it is important that we know the truth, because
knowing the truth sets us free - John 8:32

This propaganda piece from pseudo-Christian Emma is merely another
excuse for her to claim that only narrow-minded bigoted Fundamentalist
Christians would insist that Jesus is the Messiah, that Jesus rose from
the dead, that belief in Jesus is necessary for salvation, that the New
Testament is reliable, etc.
randy
2005-09-11 20:29:01 UTC
Permalink
"Emma"
Post by Emma
I found this on a website.
Interesting.....
Answers are wonderful when they are true and keep
us on the human and spiritual path. But answers are not
wonderful when they become something we have as an ego
possession, allowing us to be arrogant, falsely self assured,
and closed down as a person.
This much was very interesting, and I agree.
Post by Emma
There is something inherently valuable about an attitude
of spiritual curiosity and persistent "knocking."
It creates in us what the Greek philosophers and
prudence, fortitude, temperance, and justice.
These were considered the "hinge" virtues on which all
the other moral virtues hang and depend. If you study
each of these four virtues, you will see that
they each require an ongoing broadening, discerning,
balancing, and discovery of God's will and God's ways.
They are never virtues that you fully possess or have,
but they are always dependent on time, discernment,
prayer, and listening to others beyond your self.
This also was very good, I think. Life is a process, and virtue requires
time.
Post by Emma
Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!
This is where I have a problem. I could almost immediately think of 3
questions Jesus directly answered that wasn't listed. In his Olivet
Discourse Jesus answered the following questions:

Matthew 24:3 As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him
privately, saying, "Tell us, when will this be, and what will be the sign of
your coming and of the close of the age?"

He not only addressed these questions directly, but he went into some
detail. But yes, Jesus often seemed to answer things in ways that broadened
things into a divine perspective, something that is often difficult to nail
down. And the purpose does seem to be intentional, not to avoid the obvious
answers, but rather, to zero in on the failure of man to work things out
inwardly, rather than externally.

randy
Padraic Brown
2005-09-12 02:28:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Emma
Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!
I think that's a very unfair and illconceived accusation.
Post by Emma
The others he either ignored, kept silent about, asked them
a question in return, changed the subject, told a story or
gave an audio visual aid to make his point, told them it was
the wrong question, revealed their insincerity or hypocrisy,
made the exactly opposite point, or redirected the question
elsewhere!
Exactly! He answered the qustions directly! We have to keep in mind
that Jesus was not conducting a university course on comparative
religion; he was not participating in a press conference; and he was
not responding to an employment interviewer.

He was (pace them as think he was a God) a great thinker, philosopher
and teacher. His aim was to get us to think and act on a higher level
-- you don't do that by giving rote instructions.
Post by Emma
Many, if not most, of Jesus’ teaching would never pass
contemporary orthodoxy tests in either the Roman Office
or the Southern Baptist Convention.
I wonder what those teachings might be! I think it is true that the
Church (incl. the Catholics and the Baptists) place too much emphasis
on the form of worship; but I really wonder what problems either could
have with "many...of Jesus's teaching [sic]"???
Post by Emma
Most of his statements
are so open to misinterpretation
Possibly. Except that every Christian and Christian denomination going
seems to have the "right and only" interpretation of same! ;)))
Post by Emma
in almost all areas
except one: his insistence upon the goodness and reliability
of God.
That was his only consistent absolute.
1) “So you are a king, then?” said Pilate.
“Yes, I am a king. I was born for this” (John 18:37).
??? What translation is that? It's "you say I am a king..."

Also, I think "I was born..." goes with "...to testify to the truth".
Post by Emma
2) “Lord, teach us how to pray, just as John taught
his disciples. He said to them, ‘This is how you pray,’
and he taught them the Our Father (Luke 11:1).
Actaully, Jesus is complying with a direct command.
Post by Emma
3) “To disconcert him, one of the Pharisees put to him a
question, ‘Master, which is the greatest commandment of the
Law?’ Jesus said, ‘You must love the Lord your God with
all your heart,with all your mind, and with all your soul…
And the second is like it” (Matthew 22:36-37).
Even I can think of other questions he answers!

Padraic.

la cieurgeourea provoer mal trasfu
ast meiyoer ke 'l andrext ben trasfu.
Emma
2005-09-12 11:58:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Padraic Brown
Post by Emma
Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!
I think that's a very unfair and illconceived accusation.
Post by Emma
The others he either ignored, kept silent about, asked them
a question in return, changed the subject, told a story or
gave an audio visual aid to make his point, told them it was
the wrong question, revealed their insincerity or hypocrisy,
made the exactly opposite point, or redirected the question
elsewhere!
Exactly! He answered the qustions directly! We have to keep in mind
that Jesus was not conducting a university course on comparative
religion; he was not participating in a press conference; and he was
not responding to an employment interviewer.
He was (pace them as think he was a God) a great thinker, philosopher
and teacher. His aim was to get us to think and act on a higher level
-- you don't do that by giving rote instructions.
Yes. I suppose he came from a tradition that
debated and questioned.

So I think it's okay to admit that we aren't
sure about things in the Bible, or we find it
difficult to believe some parts of it, or
we just don't understand it all.
That is why it is such a fascinating book,
because it is so cryptic in parts.
Post by Padraic Brown
Post by Emma
Many, if not most, of Jesus’ teaching would never pass
contemporary orthodoxy tests in either the Roman Office
or the Southern Baptist Convention.
I wonder what those teachings might be! I think it is true that the
Church (incl. the Catholics and the Baptists) place too much emphasis
on the form of worship; but I really wonder what problems either could
have with "many...of Jesus's teaching [sic]"???
Well I suppose Jesus didn't put such an
emphasis on belief.
He was more concerned that his followers
should be recognised by their compassion
and good works.
Of course, Catholics and Baptists preach that
too, but they do also have a lot to say about
belief.

But I agree with you that the author of this
article should have given more examples of
what he meant. He generalised too much.
Post by Padraic Brown
Post by Emma
1) “So you are a king, then?” said Pilate.
“Yes, I am a king. I was born for this” (John 18:37).
??? What translation is that? It's "you say I am a king..."
Also, I think "I was born..." goes with "...to testify to the truth".
Post by Emma
2) “Lord, teach us how to pray, just as John taught
his disciples. He said to them, ‘This is how you pray,’
and he taught them the Our Father (Luke 11:1).
Actaully, Jesus is complying with a direct command.
Post by Emma
3) “To disconcert him, one of the Pharisees put to him a
question, ‘Master, which is the greatest commandment of the
Law?’ Jesus said, ‘You must love the Lord your God with
all your heart,with all your mind, and with all your soul…
And the second is like it” (Matthew 22:36-37).
Even I can think of other questions he answers!
Yes. I think you're right.
--
*~*~*
Emma
http://www.werenotafraid.com/
*~*~*
f***@hotmail.com
2005-09-12 13:13:49 UTC
Permalink
Emma wrote:
...
Post by Emma
Well I suppose Jesus didn't put such an
emphasis on belief.
==========

So you admit that you've never read the Gospels?

Here are 40+ verses that I obtained from doing a such of just one form
of the word:

------------begin quote-------------

Mark 1:15

and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at
hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel."


------------begin quote-------------

Mark 5:36

As soon as Jesus heard the word that was spoken, He said to the ruler
of the synagogue, "Do not be afraid; only believe."


------------begin quote-------------

Mark 9:23

Jesus said to him, "If you can believe, all things are possible to
him who believes."

------------begin quote-------------

Mark 11:23

For assuredly, I say to you, whoever says to this mountain, 'Be
removed and be cast into the sea,' and does not doubt in his heart,
but believes that those things he says will be done, he will have
whatever he says.


------------begin quote-------------

Mark 11:24

Therefore I say to you, whatever things you ask when you pray, believe
that you receive them, and you will have them.

------------begin quote-------------

Mark 16:16

He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not
believe will be condemned.

------------begin quote-------------

Mark 16:17

And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will
cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues;

------------begin quote-------------

Luke 8:50

But when Jesus heard it, He answered him, saying, "Do not be afraid;
only believe, and she will be made well."

------------begin quote-------------

Luke 24:25

Then He said to them, "O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe
in all that the prophets have spoken!

------------begin quote-------------

John 3:15

that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.

------------begin quote-------------

John 3:16

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that
whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

------------begin quote-------------

John 3:18

"He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe
is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the
only begotten Son of God.

------------begin quote-------------

John 3:36

He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not
believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on
him."

------------begin quote-------------

John 4:21

Jesus said to her, "Woman, believe Me, the hour is coming when you
will neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, worship the Father.

------------begin quote-------------

John 5:24

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in
Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment,
but has passed from death into life.

------------begin quote-------------

John 5:38

But you do not have His word abiding in you, because whom He sent, Him
you do not believe.


------------begin quote-------------

John 5:46

For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me.

------------begin quote-------------

John 5:47

But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My
words?"

------------begin quote-------------

John 6:29

Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you
believe in Him whom He sent."

------------begin quote-------------

John 6:35

And Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me
shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.

------------begin quote-------------

John 6:40

And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son
and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up
at the last day."

------------begin quote-------------

John 6:47

Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting
life.

------------begin quote-------------

John 7:38

He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will
flow rivers of living water."

------------begin quote-------------

John 8:24

Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do
not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins."

------------begin quote-------------

John 11:25

Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who
believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live.

------------begin quote-------------

John 11:26

And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe
this?"
------------begin quote-------------

John 11:40

Jesus said to her, "Did I not say to you that if you would believe
you would see the glory of God?"


------------begin quote-------------

John 11:42

And I know that You always hear Me, but because of the people who are
standing by I said this, that they may believe that You sent Me."

------------begin quote-------------

John 12:36

While you have the light, believe in the light, that you may become
sons of light." These things Jesus spoke, and departed,

------------begin quote-------------

John 12:46

I have come as a light into the world, that whoever believes in Me
should not abide in darkness.

------------begin quote-------------

John 14:1

"Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in
Me.

------------begin quote-------------

John 14:11

Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else
believe Me for the sake of the works themselves.

------------begin quote-------------

John 14:12

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that
I do he will do also; and greater works than these he will do, because
I go to My Father.


------------begin quote-------------

John 14:29

"And now I have told you before it comes, that when it does come to
pass, you may believe.

------------begin quote-------------

John 16:9

of sin, because they do not believe in Me;


------------begin quote-------------

John 16:27

for the Father Himself loves you, because you have loved Me, and have
believed that I came forth from God.

------------begin quote-------------

John 16:31

Jesus answered them, "Do you now believe?

------------begin quote-------------

John 17:8

For I have given to them the words which You have given Me; and they
have received them, and have known surely that I came forth from You;
and they have believed that You sent Me.

------------begin quote-------------

John 17:20

"I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe
in Me through their word;

------------begin quote-------------

John 17:21

that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that
they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent
Me.

------------begin quote-------------

John 19:35

And he who has seen has testified, and his testimony is true; and he
knows that he is telling the truth, so that you may believe.

------------begin quote-------------

John 20:29

Jesus said to him, "Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have
believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

------------begin quote-------------

John 20:31

but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ,
the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

------------end quote-------------
Padraic Brown
2005-09-12 16:50:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Emma
Post by Padraic Brown
Post by Emma
Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!
I think that's a very unfair and illconceived accusation.
Post by Emma
The others he either ignored, kept silent about, asked them
a question in return, changed the subject, told a story or
gave an audio visual aid to make his point, told them it was
the wrong question, revealed their insincerity or hypocrisy,
made the exactly opposite point, or redirected the question
elsewhere!
Exactly! He answered the qustions directly! We have to keep in mind
that Jesus was not conducting a university course on comparative
religion; he was not participating in a press conference; and he was
not responding to an employment interviewer.
He was (pace them as think he was a God) a great thinker, philosopher
and teacher. His aim was to get us to think and act on a higher level
-- you don't do that by giving rote instructions.
Yes. I suppose he came from a tradition that
debated and questioned.
So I think it's okay to admit that we aren't
sure about things in the Bible, or we find it
difficult to believe some parts of it, or
we just don't understand it all.
That is why it is such a fascinating book,
because it is so cryptic in parts.
Sure. I just think that the author of that article is comming at the
gospels from a perspective that will confound her efforts at
understanding it.

She focuses on Jesus's literal actions -- yes he wás at many points
enigmatic and redirecting in his answers. Her literal / legalistic /
scientific approach can't grasp what's going on.

Interesting article, though.

Padraic.

la cieurgeourea provoer mal trasfu
ast meiyoer ke 'l andrext ben trasfu.
Terry Cross
2005-09-12 23:03:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Padraic Brown
Post by Emma
Jesus is asked 183 questions directly or indirectly in
the four Gospels. He only answered 3 of them directly!
I think that's a very unfair and illconceived accusation.
Post by Emma
The others he either ignored, kept silent about, asked them
a question in return, changed the subject, told a story or
gave an audio visual aid to make his point, told them it was
the wrong question, revealed their insincerity or hypocrisy,
made the exactly opposite point, or redirected the question
elsewhere!
Exactly! He answered the qustions directly! We have to keep in mind
that Jesus was not conducting a university course on comparative
religion; he was not participating in a press conference; and he was
not responding to an employment interviewer.
He was (pace them as think he was a God) a great thinker, philosopher
and teacher. His aim was to get us to think and act on a higher level
-- you don't do that by giving rote instructions.
Post by Emma
Many, if not most, of Jesus' teaching would never pass
contemporary orthodoxy tests in either the Roman Office
or the Southern Baptist Convention.
I wonder what those teachings might be! I think it is true that the
Church (incl. the Catholics and the Baptists) place too much emphasis
on the form of worship; but I really wonder what problems either could
have with "many...of Jesus's teaching [sic]"???
Did you know that the Baptists do not have a formalized doctrine or
prescribed form of worship? Unlike that "high" churches, RC, for
example, Baptist Churches set their own agendas locally and always
have.

I think your "form of worship" comment is not appropriate to Baptists.
They are quite informal and without form.

TCross
Padraic Brown
2005-09-13 00:47:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Terry Cross
Did you know that the Baptists do not have a formalized doctrine or
prescribed form of worship? Unlike that "high" churches, RC, for
example, Baptist Churches set their own agendas locally and always
have.
I think your "form of worship" comment is not appropriate to Baptists.
They are quite informal and without form.
Fair enough! Replace by, say, Lutheran.

Padraic.
Post by Terry Cross
TCross
la cieurgeourea provoer mal trasfu
ast meiyoer ke 'l andrext ben trasfu.
chuba
2005-09-16 21:49:48 UTC
Permalink
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